Dignities and Disasters
By Robert MacNaughton
Dignities and DisastersFeb 28, 2022
Narcissism
Robert is joined by author, Integral philosophy teacher, and 40+ year veteran psychotherapist Dr. Keith Witt to explore a topic that is sometimes considered a “four letter word” in today’s culture—narcissism. Though typically thought of in narrowly defined terms, Dr. Keith Witt helps broaden our perspective through various lenses: historical, political, psychological, and Integral/developmental. Discover how there is both a narcissist and a wise self in all of us. Warning: this episode goes down some intellectual rabbit-holes as we Integral theory geeks tend to do.
Some of the topics we explore include:
- The Roman poet Ovid’s original portrayal of Narcissus
- Narcissistic traits vs. Narcissistic Personality Disorder
- The Trump phenomenon
- Authoritarian systems and narcissism
- Practices for authentic self-love
- The importance of having a sense of humour
Show notes:
1:49 - Introducing Dr. Keith Witt
4:28 - Ovid’s story of Narcissus
6:42 - Freud turns psychology into a science
10:03 - The introduction of the term “narcissism”
12:18 - Everything is relationships
15:13 - A limited number of therapy sessions with narcissists
18:54 - The difference between narcissistic traits and NPD
20:15 - The introduction of shame in children and regulation
22:14 - The Jean Piaget experiment for cognitive development
23:58 - All cultures have hierarchies
25:32 - Historical timeline of how humans developed self-awareness
27:48 - Historical figures throughout time who looked at the world through an Integral lens
29:15 - There is an epidemic of how we relate with mental illnesses
31:39 - Integral theory and Spiral Dynamics: Tribal
33:50 - Authoritarian systems and narcissism
34:43 - The Trump phenomenon
39:38 - How narcissism gets internalized at different stages of development
45:15 - Keith’s journey of learning about psychology
47:53 - The biggest blindspot in modern business is middle-management
49:24 - Regulation and the rock star/child celebrity example
52:32 - Service is one of the main vehicles out of narcissism
55:10 - Recovering from the addiction of narcissism
57:22 - Extreme opportunities to re-author self after traumatic events
1:01:25 - We are social beings
1:00:54 - Covert narcissism
1:02:34 - The importance of having a sense of humour, “hurts more, bothers us less”
1:04:47 - Using projection to help narcissists grow
1:05:24 - Looking in the mirror at both our strengths and weaknesses
1:06:04 - Different lines of development
1:06:50 - Maturity around protecting good, true, and beautiful assets like language
1:10:24 - There’s a wise self in all of us
1:11:07 - Giving feedback in a plus/delta format, focusing on strengths as well as weaknesses
Dr Keith Witt is a licensed clinical psychologist, lecturer and author dedicated to studying, teaching, and creating transformative healing systems. He’s been practicing psychotherapy in Santa Barbara, California for over 40 years, where he’s conducted over 55,000 therapy sessions with individuals, couples, and groups. Find his books, trainings, and more here: https://drkeithwitt.com/
Relationship Practice
Robert is joined by Jayson Gaddis—author, relationship expert, and coach who teaches people the one class they didn’t get in school--“How To Do Relationships.” He is the founder of The Relationship School training programs and podcast. Robert and Jayson discuss the pros and cons of relationship practices and help uncover ways that we both set ourselves up for success and failure in our relationships. Together they will take you on a journey considering some of the mechanics of what goes on in our relationships that are most important to us, whether those are professional working relationships, intimate partnerships, or at home with our kids. Are there reliable ways to work towards more health and intimacy even in the face of conflict? Jayson has a well-developed toolkit for success.
Show Notes
1:14 - Introducing Jayson Gaddis
4:16 - What is relationship practice?
4:40 - Listening in a way people feel understood, and can receive you
5:26 - All different levels of relationship
5:45 - High stakes relationships
7:00 - “If you think you’re enlightened, go spend the holidays with your family”
7:34 - The first step is not talking, it’s learning how to become a better listener
9:11 - “Captive audience,” “Monologers,” and active listening
12:34 - The disaster of feeling seen in workshops vs. not feeling seen at home
13:48 - “the authentic alien imposter” and setting better context
15:52 - Feedback and feedback for leaders
18:00 - Diversity, equity, and inclusion
19:07 - Feedback conversations as a habit and the “plus/delta” practice
20:11 - Positive versus Constructive feedback - coach John Wooden versus Bill Belicheck
22:58 - Hyper-vigilance to feel safe
24:09 - Some of us look for what’s wrong
24:45 - The “narcissistic partnerships”
25:29 - How do we know when to speak up about what’s not working?
27:09 - People don’t know how to get to a baseline of “good” and “safe”
28:54 - The work never stops.
29:19 - A collaborative partner with a growth-oriented mindset is important
30:55 - Getting to zero, aka a regulated nervous system
31:25 - Four ways we disconnect: posture, collapse, seek, avoid
33:06 - Zero is possible!
34:45 - Mutual power relationships
35:08 - Interactive regulation: I can help you regulate your nervous system
35:55 - How can you set your kids up for success to contribute to the dynamic?
39:02 - It all boils down to secure attachment
41:22 - Is there a core capability we can foster for success here?
42:48 - Secure attachment is created by the repair process after disconnection happens
43:07 - The Still Face Experiment with Dr. Edward Tronick
43:50 - Mom can’t attune to baby’s needs
45:40 - Box breathing: Allow your nervous system to move from sympathetic to parasympathetic
46:19 - Simple meditation— NESTR: Number, Emotion, Sensation, Thoughts, Resource
48:57 - The difference between Attachment Science and Attachment Parenting and Styles
51:09 - Kids emotions should not run the household
53:22 - Pitfall: “relationships are supposed to make us feel good”
54:13 - Pitfall: “conflict is not good”
55:50 - Importance of higher purpose
56:39 - Personal responsibility
58:21 - Gaddis’ new book: Getting to Zero: How to Work Through Conflict in Your High-Stakes Relationships
More from Jayson:
https://www.jaysongaddis.com/
https://relationshipschool.com/
https://www.instagram.com/jaysongaddis/
https://twitter.com/jaygaddis
https://www.facebook.com/jaysongaddisfanpage/
Fear
In this episode, Robert speaks with leadership coach Tripp Lanier to look at the quagmire of self-development -- particularly in leadership and “men’s work.” Between the space of forfeiting a sense of identity and needs and desires lies a balance where men get to be vulnerable and still sovereign. Can men walk this line with the proper intentions and a will to enjoy life at every turn? We explore all the challenges and blessings of self development. (Warning: this episode has some vulgar language)
Some of the topics we explore:
- Our most common excuses to avoid taking risks
- Laughing at our fears and shortcomings
- How to have the courage to share appreciation or constructive feedback
- What would you do if you could do whatever you wanted without consequences?
- Our inevitable mortality
Show Notes:
1:06 - Introducing Tripp
2:15 - The New Man Podcast
3:13 - Not only chasing spiritual development, looking for lasting change
5:25 - Anything can be turned into an escape
7:04 - Is fear good? Is fear used as an excuse for escape?
8:13 - Do I have to believe every fear I have?
8:36 - We’re trying hard to avoid our human experience
9:31 - Discernment around fear
11:08 - Chesterton’s Fence— do we jump over or respect the fence?
14:15 - The destructive impulse of the postmodern age
15:16 - The nuance of relationship
17:42 - Nice Guy Syndrome
18:35 - Posturing and collapsing
20:20 - Leading vs. waiting
21:11 - The fear of death
21:32 - When fear becomes noise
23:25 - These phantoms in our minds are gargoyles on the threshold
25:10 - Relief vs. peace of mind
27:17 - Saying “no” to one thing is really saying “yes” to what’s more in alignment
28:28 - Adding things vs. removing things
30:17 - Emotions as a doorway to information
30:57 - Freedom, aliveness, love, and peace
34:24 - The exoneration mindset
37:50 - Story from Invisibilia on oil rig workers
38:54 - The identity piece
43:07 - Moving the fear dial as a form of strength
49:00 - Fun as currency
51:05 - The antidote to fear is being bold
Cryptocurrency
Disclaimer: Nothing in this (or any) episode is financial advice. #nfa
Some of the topics we explore include:
- The principles and fundamental value-proposition of cryptocurrency
- ”Sound money” vs. state-backed fiat currency
- The drawbacks of "being your own bank" and other noteworthy concerns
- Crypto-mining and the environment (not an open and shut case)
Show Notes:
1:40 - Introducing Justin Ridgely
4:08 - Big pros of cryptocurrency
7:20 - At its core is the value of freedom
7:38 - “Sound money” as the opposite of state-backed currency
9:11 - Departure from the gold standard
11:16 - Implications of cryptocurrency being sound money
14:50 - Different categories of cryptocurrency
19:13 - Conversation around CBDCs
21:07 - The success of stable-coins
24:49 - Pros and cons of an evolving and growing infrastructure
26:18 - Crypto-banks, i.e. BlockFi
31:14 - This is not financial advice
32:00 - Ethereum and smart contracts
38:18 - Decentralized finance
48:00 - The cons of cryptocurrency
50:00 - The drawbacks of being your own bank
56:07 - Crypto mining and the environment
56:27 - Proof-of-work consensus
58:28 - Forcing the industry to look at using energy in a clean way
58:40 - Does this have enough utility to justify the environmental impact?
1:00:46 - There are more “disasters”...
1:01:00 - Scalability
1:04:49 - We are still in the early-adoption phase
1:07:44 - Common criticism of Ethereum: might be too expensive
1:08:30 - Scams
1:09:29 - Scams are separate from criminal activity, like ransomware
1:11:19 - And then there are scams, like “pump and dump” schemes
1:15:14 - Sometimes it’s not a conscious scheme, but then reality happens
1:17:43 - Regulation
1:19:19 - Anyone can have access to risky investments
1:20:00 - What’s the balance between protection and freedom?
1:21:27 - With radical freedom comes radical exposure
1:22:59 - Hopefully this will play out in a way that promotes compromise and collaboration
1:26:12 - Decentralized Autonomous Organizations (DAOs), from "Smart Money" to "Smart Companies"
1:28:50 - Do your own research (DYOR)
Justin Ridgely is currently Head of Finance and Operations at the Syndicate Project, and was recently Director of Operational Finance at BlockFi. Previously he was Director of Finance at Fundera, a fintech startup acquired by Nerdwallet. Earlier in his career, Justin led his own startup, was an investment banker, and also served in the Army as an Infantry Officer. He holds a BA from Emory University and an MBA from the University of Virginia.
Conservatism
In episode#6 of Dignities and Disasters, Robert MacNaughton and Michael Porcelli tease out the good, the messy middle and the bad of conservatism. Often misconstrued to be aligned with right-wing politics, conservatism emphasizes the value of the past and the wisdoms accrued through it. Whether exploring the idiosyncrasies of folk tales, the quasi-colonialism of modern day politics’ foreign affairs or the inevitable Godwin’s Law, this episode will have you thinking.
Some of the topics we explore:
- The Conservative Disposition
- Heuristics - our rules of thumb and passed down common sense
- Grandma’s Ham
- Chesterton’s Fence
- The Law of Unintended Consequences
- Nationalism
- Colonialism
- Fascism
- Religious Rule
Show Notes:
07:37 - The conservative disposition
08:20 - Heuristics
11:10 - Chesterton’s Fence
12:00 - Folk wisdom and rules of thumb
14:10 - Hesitate (Scruton’s slogan)
15:50 - Continuity
16:05 - Star Trek Prime Directive
17:02 - Unintended consequences
18:50 - Localism
20:00 - Duty and obligation
21:15 - Civility
23:00 - Moral foundations
24:30 - Tragic vision - Sowell/Pinker
29:40 - The messy middle
32:17 - Grandma’s ham
36:05 - Live caller #1
42:09 - The grapevine telephone
46:05 - Patriotism
46:35 - Enthocentricity
49:34 - Libertarianism
50:09 - Mistrust of experts and Populism
52:35 - Conservatism vs the Right
54:19 - Religious rule
55:07 - Reactionary and neo-reactionary conservatism
56:43 - Neo vs Paleo conservatism
57:33 - Imperialism and colonialism
58:35 - Isolationism
59:40 - Ethno nationalism
1:03:37 - Live caller #2
1:15:29 - Conclusion
Cartoon: Our Blessed Kingdom and Their Barbarous Wastes
References:
How to be a Conservative by Roger Scruton
Thomas Sowell - Conflict of visions
Jonathan Haidt - The Righteous Mind (Moral Foundations theory)
Edmund Burke (1729-1797) - originator of political conservatism as a philosophy
Healthcare
In episode#5 of Dignities and Disasters, Robert MacNaughton and Dr. David Tusek embark on an exploration of the turbulent world of healthcare and share some visions for what's possible ahead. While the rage and disappointment can lead to despondency, healthcare workers are finding ways to get back to doing what they have always wanted to do--ensuring people have healthier lives. How can we extract the good from the broken and forge ahead with inspiration? Dr. Tusek seems to be several steps ahead of the pack.
Some of the topics we explore:
- A quick tour of the 3 "dominant logic systems": traditional/ethnocentric, modern/meritocratic, postmodern/pluralistic/progressive (developmental psychology, spiral dynamics, integral theory)
- Us vs Them - creating the right energy for change
- Dr. Tusek’s 10 Heartbreaks (full article here on CloudMedical.io)
- Pathogenic (disease-based) vs Salutogenic (health-based) healthcare
- The #1 cause of bankruptcy, the #3 cause of death, and the profession with the highest suicide rate
- Iatrogenesis - "Harm done by the healer"
- What does "holistic" healthcare look like?
- The Four Disconnections - Body, Higher Self, Relationships, and Nature
- 40/40/40: Produce local and reduce waste
- Direct Primary Care and the importance of the primary care relationship
- The system we need and the examples already in practice
- Ravel.health and a developing vision for the future of distributed (vs socialized) healthcare
Shownotes:
01:39 - Who is Dr. David Tusek
07:00 - Us vs Them
19:00 - Rage and the need to grieve
27:16 - The 10 Heartbreaks, or the 10 P's: Payment
40:20 - Practice
48:19 - Profit
52:57 - Power
58:17 - Potential
1:07:48 - Precision
1:12:00 - Perspicuity
1:14:04 - Privacy
1:16:38 - Personal Freedom
1:18:45 - Passion for Medicine
1:23:44 - Healthcare vs ‘Sick’care
1:24:39 - The Four Disconnections
1:30:30 - Farmers and food
1:35:43 - 40/40/40
1:39:21 - Ravel Health
Dr. Tusek is a board-certified family physician who also has experience as an emergency room doctor. He is a member of the Academy of Sports Medicine, the American Academy of Anti-Aging Medicine, and the Institute of Functional Medicine. Dr. Tusek relishes the close connectivity with his Cloud DPC patients, whether they are training for the Olympics, dealing with an illness, or simply trying to lose a few pounds. He believes that enhancing your quality of life is just as important as extending the quantity of your years. Dr. Tusek combines expertise in advanced diagnostics and optimization of brain and body function using a broad-based approach, blending cutting edge technologies with a natural orientation. He uses a wide variety of gentle, needle-based therapies to treat musculoskeletal and neuromuscular conditions and injuries (including PRP and botox). He performs various office-based surgeries, cryosurgeries, and treatments of minor trauma. In 2004, he became one of the first practitioners in Colorado to offer bio-identical hormone implants, and has been working closely with compounding pharmacies (those pharmacies that prepare personalized medications for patients), to provide the purest, most effective forms of natural therapies. In 2009, Dr. Tusek co-founded one of the nation’s first DPC programs, which he sold in 2016. He then went on to launch Cloud Medical DPC, and currently oversees several other healthcare ventures including Cloud Collective.
Wealth
“Money -- It's a crime. Share it fairly but don't take a slice of my pie.
Money -- it's a hit. Don't give me that-do-goody good bullshit.”
Pink Floyd
"Society is demanding that companies, both public and private, serve a social purpose. To prosper over time, every company must not only deliver financial performance, but also show how it makes a positive contribution to society."
Larry Fink, CEO BlackRock (the world's largest asset manager)
In episode #4 of Dignities & Disasters Robert discusses Wealth--joined by Greg Berry from Conscious Capital Wealth Management. While money and investments can incentivize greed, it can also be used as a tool for the betterment of society, the environment, and all of us here on Earth. In a system full of imbalances--how do we develop a relationship with wealth that avoids wanting to burn it all down? We investigate the good, the bad, and the ugly of wealth.
Points discussed:
- Holistic Wealth -- 5 Forms of Capital: Financial - money and investments ; Material - business, home, real estate ; Social - family and community ; Human - health, career, legacy ; Purpose - why you are here
- Whole wealth advisory & Pragmatic radicalism
- Wealth divide
- Hoarding impulse and incentives
- Interest acts as an accelerator in both directions (wealth and debt)
- Typically takes 7 years to escape debt
- Pervasiveness of one type of capital
- Growth that's impacting our environment: (Charles Eisenstein ; The Population Bomb -- Paul Ehrlich)
- Charity -- you can do good things with money
- Responsible debt / loans
- Re-valuing the ecosystems
- Impact Investing. From: Socially responsible investing (SRI) → Environmental, Social, and Governance (ESG) → Systems Change Investing (SCI)
- Modern Monetary Theory (MMT) & the “Great Reset” conversations at Davos
Resources:
- The Creature from Jekyll Island: A Second Look at the Federal Reserve -- G. Edward Griffin
Greg Berry is a Whole Wealth Advisor at Conscious Capital Wealth Management. For over 25 years, Greg has been an advisor to entrepreneurs, investors, philanthropists and executives, both in the famous entrepreneurial ecosystem of Boulder, Colorado, and across several continents. He guides people at different points of wealth creation to evolve their relationship with wealth and money, towards more holistic and responsible approach, which is now commonly called 'impact investing.' For over 10 years, he has been an activist and catalyst for the impact investing community in Colorado.
Capitalism
In this episode of Dignities and Disasters, Robert MacNaughton and Michael Porcelli wade into the murky waters of capitalism. What evokes a bitter taste in the mouth for some, is to others an ideology that has advanced society in the direction of innovation and prosperity. From financial mechanisms through free market exchange and privatization of production, what exactly is capitalism? What has it done right and where has it fallen down?
Some of the topics we explore:
Context:
- Semantics, healthy debate, and mutual understanding
Dignities:
- Private ownership of the means of production, and operation for profit as a way of getting goods and services into hands that need them
- Voluntary exchange--freedom to inter a transaction without government intervention
- The pricing mechanism, aka the market, which informs supply & demand, and leads to innovation
- Real-Estate vs “Un-Real”-Estate (fictitious monetary instruments)
- Market efficiencies
- Collectivization of ownership -- e.g. the Dutch East Indies Company
- Decentralized “planning”
- Profit incentive & efficiency of capital accumulation
- Wage labor is better than slave/serf labor
- Complex industrial division of labor
- Property rights
- Keynesian macroeconomic perspectives
- Socially responsible (ESG) investment funds
- The Montreal Protocol (not the Moscow treaty 😉)
- Ephemeralization and dematerialization, ala Buckminster Fuller
Disasters:
- Marx pointed these out, but purists see these as perversions of capitalism:
- Cronyism -- appointing positions not for merit, but for nefarious benefit
- Corporatism -- rigging the system to benefit certain corporations
- Regulatory capture - regulations are dictated by those in power, which are affiliated with corporations due to cronyism
- “Businessmen are enemies of capitalism” - Adam Smith
- Incumbent driven vs market driven?
- Private collectives / Limited liability / corporate personhood
- Negative Externalities
- Speculative investment / money-on-money returns / financialization
- Debt-based currency
- Wage labor is “wage slavery” and value extractive
- Renting as exploitation and rent seeking behaviors
- Green-washing
- Robert’s inability to speak clearly at the end was pretty disastrous…. 😉
Resources:
- A16z podcast with Andrew McAfee: The Environment, Capitalism, Technology
- Roger Scruton - How to be a Conservative
- Steven Pinker - Enlightenment Now
Socialism
In this episode of Dignities & Disasters, Robert MacNaughton and Michael Porcelli discuss one of the topics on the tips of the tongues of the United States these days. When it comes to Socialism, the definition itself seems to be loosely adopted by the political agenda it is pushing. We drive to the heart of socialism in many of its forms and unpack the good, the bad, and the confusing. We call this version 0.1 of addressing this topic since we’re not political or economic authorities, and we’re just scratching the surface of this far-sweeping and divisive area of discussion.
Some of the topics we explore:
The Basics:
- Social ownership of the means of production
- Marx defined and popularized “Capitalism” in Das Kapital
- Authoritarian socialism (Eastern bloc) vs democratic socialism (Western bloc)
- The Nordic model is not socialism, but a social democracy or “cuddly capitalism”; free market capitalist with a more generous welfare state and a high personal tax burden shared by medium and low income households
The Dignities:
- Humans are inherently equal, and everyone should have an equal opportunity to thrive
- We spread the benefits of social membership to those whose own efforts do not suffice to obtain basic welfare
- We enjoy the fruits of society only if we are also ready to share them
- Nobody suffers from their basic needs not being met due to no fault of their own
- Why you should be a socialist: wealth disparity; crony capitalism; obvious distribution problems ; basic social welfare
The Disasters:
- Creation of a class of dependents
- Antagonizes those that live responsibly and separates dependents from a full experience of citizenship
- Open ended budgets with ever increasing costs and borrowing from the future
- The issue is politicized -- e.g. Marx’s war language; an essential antagonism between proletariat and bourgeoisie; class war, only when fomented by political leaders: e.g. Lenin in Russia, Mao in China
- Measuring Poverty -- Poverty is defined relatively -- “Relative Deprivation” e.g. the British Labor govt defined poverty as “people with 60% of median income”. Whereas the World Bank defines poverty in absolute terms -- defining extreme poverty as living on less than US$1.90 per day
- The “zero sum vision” -- a fallacy that sees life where every success requires someone’s failure, i.e. winning requires losing
- The over involvement of the state paid by taxes on working classes
- Cannot admit that the poor benefit from the wealth of the wealthy
- Lenin: October Revolution, Stalin: the kulaks, and Hitler: the Jews
- The failed socialist nations, Communism, The totalitarian temptation to remake society
- An attempt to realize a heaven that inevitably leads to hell
Resources mentioned:
- Roger Scruton - How to be a Conservative
- Why You Should be a Socialist - Nathan Robinson
- Proven Practices for this Pandemic Crisis with Daniel P Brown (re: learned helplessness vs virtuous cycle of self-improvement) from the State of Emergence podcast with Terry Patten
- Countries that have tried socialism and failed - Forbes
Postmodernism
Join us for this nuanced investigation of the postmodernism worldview as Robert MacNaughton and Michael Porcelli unpack what’s worth keeping and what’s gone over the edge in this late 20th century movement that questions all that would normally be considered "True."
There’s a lot of discussion these days about all of the dangers of postmodernism if you’re plugged into the “Intellectual Dark Web”--e.g. identity politics, political correctness, partisan politics, and cancel culture. What you won’t easily find is an appropriate nuanced acknowledgement of what’s important about how postmodernism has up-leveled our culture and therefore shouldn’t be disregarded wholesale. The aim here is to distinguish both sides as fairly as we can--acknowledging our biases where we’re aware of them--and giving you the best opportunity to recognize where and how these elements live in your own world.
As this is the first episode in this series, we decided to start with some philosophical foundations. In many ways, helping our clients, friends, and community with the “pitfalls of postmodernism” has been a primary inspiration for this project, and the principles explored here will likely echo through the series.
Further Resources:
Trump and a Post-Truth World by Ken Wilber
Cynical Theories: How Activist Scholarship Made Everything about Race, Gender, and Identity―and Why This Harms Everybody by Helen Pluckrose & James Lindsay
Robert MacNaughton, host, is an executive coach and facilitator who is a pioneer in the fields of Integral community organization, leadership development, and experiential education. Robert focuses on supporting leaders with execution strategies, fostering healthy work culture, and navigating interpersonal conflict both personally and professionally. Robert co-founded the bygone Integral Center in Boulder, Colorado in association with renowned philosopher Ken Wilber, which hosted an international community of thought leaders, practitioners, and "evolutionaries."
Michael Porcelli, co-host and "pandit” or general subject matter expert, is a coach, educator, writer, speaker, facilitator, consultant, and specialist in social technology. Over his career, he’s developed insight into the dynamics between human beings, technology, and the social world. He has expertise in Authentic Relating; Holacracy; Evolutionary, Teal, & For-Purpose Enterprises. Michael is a founding member with Bedrock Culture and Leadership, and a former colleague of Robert’s at the Integral Center where he directed curriculum and faculty development
Introducing Dignities and Disasters
Integral Centered Leadership presents Dignities & Disasters, a podcast series that attempts to skillfully tease out both sides of divisive topics. Instead assuming it's right or wrong, we're encouraging our listeners to get more informed and develop a sophisticated understanding of these important subjects. Hosted by executive coach and facilitator Robert MacNaughton.