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Heterodorx

Heterodorx

By Nina Paley
Heterodox dorks Nina Paley and Corinna Cohn talk about whatever they feel like.
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Extra Bonus Raw and Unedited Rantings
The Dorx couldn't wait for Corinna to edit the 2 recorded episodes in the queue, so they had a spontaneous RAW & UNEDITED conversation and are slapping it up here WITHOUT COOKING OR EDITING! Yes, it's as uncooked as a 19-year-old's brain, which doesn't finish baking until age 25 or a toothpick inserted in the center comes out clean. We discuss transing as a social phenomenon, Fundamental Attribution Error, long pauses, male detransitioners, the white supremacist mass shooter in Buffalo, and the decline of American hegemony. Hopefully it'll stave off hunger until our next fine well-edited episodes come out of the oven. Bon appetit!
20:35
May 15, 2022
Voluntary Human Extinction with Les U. Knight
Which would hasten the Apocalypse faster: population decline, or population increase? Economists urge growth, but Les U Knight, discoverer of the Voluntary Human Extinction Movement, argues the peaceful, gradual elimination of humanity would be better for everyone - especially humanity itself. We discuss contraception, Insectageddon, donuts, the Demographic Transition Theory, ritual human sacrifice, and what would happen if we got rid of Netflix. May we Live Long and Die Out! VHEMT web site: vhemt.org Nina on the Jerry Springer show with the Church of Euthenasia in 1997: https://vimeo.com/235654079 Virginia Abernethy - Population Politics (which includes a debunking of the Demographic Transition Theory): https://books.google.com/books/about/Population_Politics.html?id=oJ4jngEACAAJ
01:02:47
May 12, 2022
BioTrans with Kikomi
In a very “meta” episode that probably won’t make sense to those not deeply involved in online transactivism, the Dorx speak with BioTransGirl Kikomi. Kikomi was Assigned Female At Birth (AFAB) and identifies as a man who identifies as a woman: a transwoman. We learn how BioTrans are even more marginalized and oppressed than trans, not even validated by Stonewall or the ACLU. Nina realizes she may be a BioTrans “egg”, but if she "comes out" she could face BioTransphobia or worse: biodetransition. Should she get vaginoplasty on her front hole? Does she have autoandrogynephelia? Will she replace Corinna as the One True Trans? Perhaps the most marginalized of all are the .02% of the population capable of getting these jokes. Kikomi on Twitter: https://twitter.com/BioTransGirl Kikomi comics: https://archive.org/details/kikomi/ BioTrans insufficiently welcome at Nina’s local bike club: https://blog.ninapaley.com/2022/03/21/cycling-and-gender-intersect-in-meaningful-ways/ TERF-Tranny Alliance: https://www.heterodorx.com/terftrannyalliance/
44:28
May 05, 2022
Listener Questions
Second time's a charm as the Dorx answer YOUR questions, after answering them a week earlier in a session that failed to record properly. What are our favorite podcasts? What would we have done differently? How is putting on a dress and having fake breasts different to blacking up and wearing an afro wig? Is there Right Wing creep in the GC movement? Is it too soon to hope? Do we have autogynephilia? Learn the answers to these questions and more on this hot, re-heated, re-recorded episode! Links: Grace Lavery interview: https://www.heterodorx.com/podcast/episode-26-trano-a-trano-with-grace-lavery/ Greg Dember on Metamodernism: https://www.heterodorx.com/podcast/episode-16-metamodernism-with-greg-dember/ Put Yourself First (In a Sexy Way): https://youtu.be/H2lmojePnA0 Andrea Dworkin - Right Wing Women: https://www.feministes-radicales.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/Andrea-DWORKIN-Right-Wing-Women-The-Politics-of-Domesticated-Females-19831.pdf University of Illinois requires DEI statements for tenure and promotion: https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2022/04/01/u-illinois-require-diversity-statements-tenure
50:06
April 28, 2022
Autogynephilia with J Michael Bailey
J Michael Bailey authored the seminal The Man Who Would Be Queen, which attempted to bring to a mainstream audience Blachard’s “Two Types” of male transsexuality: effeminate homosexuals, and autogynephiles, men sexually aroused at the idea of themselves as women. Is autogynephilia (AGP) a sexuality, a paraphilia, or both? Is male bisexuality linked to AGP? How common is AGP? (Bailey: “We don’t know.” Corinna: “Very, at tech conferences.”) What are the similarities between autogynephiles, furries, wannabe amputees, and "adult babies"? Can women be GAMPs? Are traps gay? What is up with adult AGP men favoring castrating AGP boys? Questions abound, but one thing is for certain: it’s one hell of a paraphilia. The Man Who Would be Queen - free PDF download https://faculty.wcas.northwestern.edu/JMichael-Bailey/TMWWBQ.pdf Michael Bailey on Google Scholar: https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=o_vo1p0AAAAJ&hl=en https://psychology.northwestern.edu/people/faculty/core/profiles/michael-bailey.html Nina’s San Francisco Sex-Postive Memoirs (again): https://4w.pub/sex-pos-memoirs/
01:21:02
April 19, 2022
Calm and Wreasonable Colin Wright
Evolutionary biologist and gender-critical free speech advocate Colin Wright tries to throw the Dorx a bone by introducing himself with bun/buns/bunself pronouns, but remains indisputably a paragon of calm reason. Our conversation calmly and reasonably meanders through Wright’s early cancelation, academia, social contagions and cycles of silence, saving women’s sports, whether social media is making us insane, and the resemblance of wokeism to creationism. Nina is lulled into such a calm state that she doesn’t even challenge Corinna and Colin when they question whether “Patriarchy” is a Thing. Is it possible to be TOO calm and reasonable? Listen in and find out! Wright's Substack, Reality’s Last Stand: https://www.realityslaststand.com/ Wright’s cancelation story on Quillette: https://quillette.com/2020/07/30/think-cancel-culture-doesnt-exist-my-own-lived-experience-says-otherwise/ FAIR (Foundation Against Intolerance & Racism): https://www.fairforall.org/ Wright’s Twitter: https://mobile.twitter.com/SwipeWright/ Genderism descends on Nina’s local bike club: https://blog.ninapaley.com/2022/03/21/cycling-and-gender-intersect-in-meaningful-ways/
58:15
April 05, 2022
Potty Mouths
While some Radical Feminists consider bathrooms (aka toilets) a distraction from more salient and enforceable realms of prisons, shelters, sports, and therapeutic settings, for others they represent the front lines of women’s boundaries in public space. Nina and Corinna have an honest, long-postponed, and undoubtedly controversial discussion about the reality of who uses which toilets, when, and why. But first, they discuss how the TERF-Tranny Alliance is accelerating the Apocalypse, the history of the term “gender critical,” and the difference between “pet trans” and actual pets. This episode is sure to piss off just about everyone! TERF-Tranny Alliance: https://www.heterodorx.com/terftrannyalliance/ Genspect Detransition webinar: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AnvZvqwIR7o Ideological Totalism: https://theradicalnotion.org/ideological-totalism-left-and-right/ Does Sex Matter? 2019 panel discussion at the Urbana Free Library, featuring Corinna Cohn, Carey Callahan, and Nina Paley. Talk: https://youtu.be/RguD61siLB8 Q & A: https://vimeo.com/326585294
53:58
March 28, 2022
Cynthia Breheny Literally Erases by Drawing
The Dorx chat with Cynthia Breheny, a sexist, racist, and transphobic artist who perverts free speech and art as a means to hurt people. OR DOES SHE?? Perhaps she’s a sweet, young, unusually moderate illustrator with her own interesting history of gender dysphoria and heterodox gender-diverse friends. Nina, as Elder Artist and TERF, imparts her aged wisdom upon the young’un, while Corinna is unafraid to face accusations of “erasing” kinky toddlers. Is there hope for the future? Maybe! Cynthia Breheny of Twitter: https://twitter.com/PTElephant Website: https://www.ptelephant.com/
57:17
March 23, 2022
MK Fain Wants to Keep Fighting
Corinna and Nina welcome back MK Fain, creator of women's social network Spinster.xyz and online feminist news publication 4w.pub. Life has dished out some tough lessons in the intervening 10 months, and Fain is a fast learner. She shares newfound wisdom about having a life outside “the Movement,” purity spirals, Truth mills, scapegoating, infighting, fracturing, and cults. After resolving not to join anything in 2022, Fain becomes the newest member of the TERF-Tranny Alliance, and Nina looks forward to Death. Then the Dorx get philosophical about the difference between oppressors and leaders, the nature of human hierarchies, telling the truth as well as questioning it, writer’s block, and spaying and neutering our pets — and ourselves. Somehow all this inspires Fain to continue her fight for justice; maybe she'll inspire you too.
01:05:28
March 17, 2022
Bully-Proofing the Grown-ups with Stella O’Malley
After Nina goes on about copyright abolition again, our delightful guest discusses her new book, Bully-Proof Kids (© Stella O’Malley 2022). All the adults in this conversation have been - and are currently being - bullied by other adults; will techniques for kids and families work for us too? The power to make or break bullies is in the hands of bystanders, whom O’Malley urges to become upstanders. Nina and Corinna are cynical as ever, and at one point the Dorx sound like mental patients arguing with their therapist. Did we mention O’Malley is a therapist? She’s got her work cut out for her, in this episode and beyond! Bully-Proof Kids: http://www.stellaomalley.com/bullyproof-kids The TERF-Tranny Alliance: https://www.heterodorx.com/terftrannyalliance/
48:50
March 07, 2022
Tokens of the Apocalypse
Corinna surprises Nina with a spontaneous “Fresh Air”-style interview about Apocalypse Animated, her just-completed project. They discuss hairy Semites, the Whore of Babylon, vaginal symbolism of the New Jerusalem, depicting fire, tesseracts, a cute Lamb, galloping horses, and Corinna’s new career as an activist. Corinna has now testified twice in favor of Indiana House Bill 1041, which seeks to prohibit boys from girls’ school athletics teams. Does Corinna’s voice carry more authority as a transsexual? Unfortunately yes, because even though we all know tokenism is unfair and wrong, it is the coin of the identity politics realm. Indiana House Bill 1041: http://iga.in.gov/legislative/2022/bills/house/1041 Corinna’s first testimony: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=CZDobmmiNlg Apocalypse Animated: https://apocalypseanimated.com/ Muybridge horse quilt: https://blog.ninapaley.com/2015/04/29/horse-quiltimation/ Theo’s Entrepreneurial Research & Fabrication Space: https://www.palegraylabs.com/ NO TERFS: https://spinster.xyz/@ninapaley/posts/AGR6XS3UEkgHtJ2VbE
44:50
February 17, 2022
True Faith with Aaron Rabinowitz
Aaron Rabinowitz identifies as an atheist, skeptic, and philosopher. He’s also a faithful trans ally, and considers the adjective “religious” an insult. Acutely aware of his cisheteronormative privilege, he willingly sacrifices himself on the altar of Heterodorx because “my humanity is not being questioned in this particular debate.” The resultant conversation is even more fascinating than it is long (1:46, our longest yet!). Listen closely and you just might have a religious experience. Embrace the Void podcast: https://voidpod.com/podcasts Philosophers in Space podcast: https://0gphilosophy.libsyn.com/ Aaron Rabinowitz at The Skeptic: https://www.skeptic.org.uk/author/aaronrabinowitz/ I Enjoy Being a Girl: https://youtu.be/iEW_nXwWvd4
01:46:36
February 09, 2022
Cancel Klatch with Razib Khan
Razib Khan is a Bangladeshi-American writer in population genetics and consumer genomics (wikipedia). He identifies as a Coconut, and is a repeat member of Club Cancel, getting denounced by friends and associates approximately every 6 months. He and the Dorx start the episode by erasing as many ethnicities, religions, and genders as they can. Then Khan recounts the sorry tale of Scientific American (a science fiction magazine) and late great biologist E.O. Wilson. Our smart and funny guest is all bravado and self-confidence until Nina asks him to define “woman,” the question that brings even the toughest intellectuals to their knees. Setting the record straight: open letter on E.O. Wilson's legacy: https://razib.substack.com/p/setting-the-record-straight-open
01:05:40
February 06, 2022
Upperhand Mars and Team TERF’s Moving Goalposts
Trans YouTuber, media manager of Gender Dysphoria Alliance, and eminent voice of reason Mars F has long been a target of more extreme trans rights activists; now Mars is also receiving abuse from "the other side." “Transmen are our sisters” is an old TERF saying, but some aren’t acting very sisterly today. Mars also shares some cringey transition delusions from more naive times; a personal account of testosterone’s health consequences; and the secret of looking young (“don’t stay up late and don’t do crack”). Relax and enjoy the soothing sound of reasonable people talking reasonably. Mars’s Youtube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCK792gI7-zEik0tB1Ok0l6Q Mars on Twitter: https://twitter.com/UpperhandMars Gender Dysphoria Alliance: https://www.genderdysphoriaalliance.com/
01:09:48
January 31, 2022
Carole Hooven
The Dorx enjoy a lively and information-packed conversation with Dr. Carole Hooven, author of T: The Story of Testosterone, the Hormone that Dominates and Divides Us. Curious and compassionate, she expresses grief that Corinna never got a chance to fuck his brains out with other boys. Nina is full of questions: can females have Complete Androgen Insensitivity? What happens to ovaries in menopause? How do you define woman? Hooven wants to know what made Nina “peak trans,” so Nina briefly recounts her TERFening in 2017-2018. Corinna, who needs to eat more carbs and put on some body fat because endogenous sex steroid production relies on cholesterol, shares some thoughts on non-binary identities, after which the conversation culminates in how awesome Heterodorx is. This episode is guaranteed to make you smarter! http://www.carolehooven.com/ https://twitter.com/hoovlet/ https://us.macmillan.com/books/9781250236067/tthestoryoftestosteronethehormonethatdominatesanddividesus
01:32:54
January 27, 2022
GAMPs, Pr0n, trans, and the Conservation of Evil
After Nina expresses admiration for the insult “Haterodorx”, Corinna - “one of the good ones” - expresses concern about the inevitable backlash coming for trans people. We learn about GAMPs: GynoAndroMorphPhiles, and the “chicks with dicks” they fetishize. Corinna makes Nina watch some horrible TikTok videos so they can discuss young people sexualizing themselves for visual consumption. Then the Dorx examine porn’s influence on the “trans community” and young people in general, staying remarkably lighthearted in spite of the dismal subject matter. This episode 100% passes! Song: “Penis Envy” by Uncle Bonsai: https://youtu.be/ByE5Bc70w44 Heterodorx (aka Corinna) on Twitter: https://twitter.com/heterodorx
57:46
January 19, 2022
The Heterodorx 2021 Year in Review
The Dorx take a trip down memory lane, scanning the show notes of every single episode straight from the web site, and wondering in awe at this podcast’s dazzling journey from three to sixteen listeners in under a year. Thanks for listening to and supporting us, TERFs and Trannies, and have a great 2022!
52:60
January 01, 2022
Alice Dreger's Middle Finger*
The Dorx welcome Alice Dreger, author of the excellent Galileo’s Middle Finger. Dreger discusses Intersex as a political identity, what makes her feel like a woman, the trials of puberty, lactose intolerance, the importance of talking to kids about sexual pleasure, and East Lansing Info, a model local journalism organization she founded. Then she talks about “discriminatory and hateful” segregation in sports. Hold onto your hats!  *Some people are born with more than 10 fingers; others with fewer. Whether due to genetic anomolies or amputation, some have no fingers at all. So who are we to say what a “middle finger” even is? Galileo’s Middle Finger https://alicedreger.com/GMF East Lansing Info https://eastlansinginfo.news/ Alice in Genderland https://aliceingenderland.com/ What’s Happening to Me https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/141764._What_s_Happening_to_Me_A_Guide_to_Puberty How Babies Are Made https://www.amazon.com/How-Babies-Made-Steven-Schepp/dp/1626541043 Nina’s Sex-Positive Memoirs https://4w.pub/sex-pos-memoirs/ Heterodorx interview with Grace Lavery (who also declines to define 'woman'): https://www.heterodorx.com/podcast/episode-26-trano-a-trano-with-grace-lavery/
01:31:38
December 24, 2021
Elizabeth Hungerford
The Dorx speak with attorney and feminist Elizabeth Hungerford, co-author of a seminal 2011 letter to the UN about gender identity’s impacts on sex-based rights. Should feminists ally with conservatives? Should genderism be classified as a religion? Do we criticize gender, or abolish it? Is sex-blindness a spectrum? Who wears a potato sack better, Corinna or Nina? Is it easier to fool men than women, about sex? Can taboos be beneficial? Hungerford bravely withstands being mint-chocolate-chip-shamed by Nina, in this gentle, respectful, and deep exchange of ideas and “yucking someone else’s yum.” Cathy Brennan and Elizabeth Hungerford letter to the UN: https://sexnotgender.com/gender-identity-legislation-and-the-erosion-of-sex-based-legal-protections-for-females/ The Radical Notion: https://theradicalnotion.org/ Detransition: Beyond Before and After by Max Robinson: https://www.spinifexpress.com.au/shop/p/9781925950403 Feminist Ethics by Sarah Hoagland: https://www.sarahhoagland.com/sarahhoaglandles.html Male/Female face optical illusion: https://www.opticalspy.com/opticals/male-or-female-face-optical-illusion Yummy Yuck (children's book): https://www.amazon.com/Yummy-Yuck-Amanda-Jane-Jones/dp/3791374052/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=yuck+and+yum&qid=1639705440&sr=8-1
01:00:17
December 17, 2021
The Grift Episode
Corinna and Nina discuss podcast-related expenses, such as microphone covers, multi-track remote recording service, and Fried Tofu w Numb Oil. For the first time, the Dorx ask for donations, but only for a few minutes, after which they change the subject to JK Rowling’s Twitter namechecks and the importance of talking to your godchildren about the transcult. Nina confronts her Internalized Transphobia and learns about Inner Pronouns, while Corinna reveals his many deadnames, and the sock-shaped hole in his heart. Then they ask for money again, before talking about used handkerchiefs. It’s the kind of quality content worth supporting! Donate to Heterodorx at https://anchor.fm/heterodorx Golden Harbor #807 Fried Tofu w Numb Oil https://www.goldenharboronline.com/menus https://www.patreon.com/ninapaley
39:47
November 30, 2021
Abolishing Gender, not Sex, with Kara Dansky
The Dorx welcome lawyer, gender abolitionist, and fierce feminist Kara Dansky, who has just released a new book, The Abolition of Sex: How the “Transgender” Agenda Harms Women and Girls. Dansky fills us in on the ACLU’s “unlikely allies,” the disgraceful biases and failures of American mainstream media, and that she might soon drop the term “Gender Critical.” It’s a stimulating, challenging, and thought-provoking conversation. Links: https://www.amazon.com/Abolition-Sex-Transgender-Agenda-Harms/dp/1637582293 https://nypost.com/2021/03/27/prof-who-refused-transgender-students-pronouns-wins-in-court/ https://slate.com/human-interest/2015/12/gender-critical-trans-women-the-apostates-of-the-trans-rights-movement.html https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2014/08/04/woman-2
01:25:39
November 19, 2021
Bad Science with Maneesh Yadav
Maneesh Yadav has a PhD in…SCIENCE! Chemistry, to be precise, and his favorite molecule is porphine. Is that enough expertise to guide Nina through the morass of COVID misinformation confronting her online? From Tamiflu and arsenic life, to calling women “bodies with vaginas”, the Dorx explore why science journals and institutions have lost so much credibility in recent years, and how we might find our way when we need reliable scientific evidence more than ever. Links: Tamiflu https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4375804/ Arsenic Life https://www.nbcnews.com/science/cosmic-log/arsenic-life-debate-still-percolates-flna6C10402703 Can’t Get You Out Of My Head (Adam Curtis) https://www.imdb.com/title/tt13973190/
01:11:34
November 14, 2021
Down the Motherhood Well with Lisa Marchiano
Jungian analyst Lisa Marchiano takes the Dorx on a journey through myth and folktales as she discusses stories from her recent book, Motherhood. Following the classic arc of descent and return, Corinna drops the sarcasm for literally minutes before noting the sexist and exclusionary title. Nina promises to ban this deep and compelling tome, because as a non-mother it’s not specifically about her. This is an unusually profound and calming episode, so definitely don’t buy this book or check it out of a library near you! https://lisamarchiano.com/books/
01:13:19
November 05, 2021
How Inclusive is Misogyny?
In this episode of Heterodorx, Nina tries very very hard not to say “y’know,” because Corinna no longer edits out her verbal tics. As a result, she speaks unusually slowly, thoughtfully, and almost as sarcastically as Corinna. Thus disciplined, the two dutifully slog away at conversation, discussing Dave Chapelle, the definition of misogyny, power, corruption, “respectability politics,” “conservative humor,” media gaslighting, and wearing “male garb” at the Rennaissance Faire. It’s worth a listen, y’know?
53:45
October 28, 2021
Woke Antisemitism with Andrew Pessin
The Dorx welcome lively philosophy professor and author Andrew Pessin, whose recent satirical novel about campus culture, Nevergreen, humorously conveys the horror of getting cancelled. This inevitably leads to discussion of the Anti-Defamation League’s “Pryramid of Hate,” which, by the end of the episode, Nina deftly synthesizes with the USDA’s Food Pyramid. Corinna asserts, “universities are in the business of transferring wealth from students to administrators,” and repeatedly declares he is NOT JEWISH, unlike Andrew (a Zionist) and Nina (not a Zionist), who blithely argue about Zionism the way only a couple American Jews can. Links: Andrew Pessin’s website: https://andrewpessin.com/ Nevergreen: https://andrewpessin.com/nevergreen/ ADL Pyramid of Hate: https://www.adl.org/sites/default/files/documents/pyramid-of-hate.pdf USDA Food Pyramid: https://fns-prod.azureedge.net/sites/default/files/archived_projects/FGPLargeGIF.gif This Land Is Mine: https://vimeo.com/50531435 From Seder-Masochism: https://vimeo.com/263398514 Nina on hate: Love Thine Enemy https://blog.ninapaley.com/2021/09/27/love-thy-enemy/ Nina relates Zionism to Transactivism: https://blog.ninapaley.com/2018/02/07/gender_colonialism/
01:26:54
October 18, 2021
Gettin' Philosophical with Alex Byrne
The Dorx interrogate MIT Professor Alex Byrne, to find out what the heck happened to academic Philosophy. But first, Corinna identifies as some brand of chocolate. Alex illuminates Feminist Philosophy, differences between philosophers, and the mental aspects of his beer, while Corinna asserts the immutability of sex and mens’ eagerness to eject their “feminine” brothers from the male sex class. Finally, Nina detransitions from humanhood and re-identifies as a Martian. Alex Byrne’s Philosophy: Minds and Machines: https://youtu.be/DfgCJR7xKQ0
01:45:41
September 30, 2021
Goin' Tribal with Derrick Jensen
Derrick “Kid Kaboom” Jenson, author of 10,000 books translated into 2,000 languages, shares both untrue and true stories about the environmental movement, and why “Sustainable Development” is an oxymoron. After a short break for Derrick to get wild bears to stop banging on his windows, the Dorx discuss the heartbreak of witnessing the destruction of wild habitats and the suffering of nonhuman species. Later, they try to define religion, and debate whether “a language is a dialect with an army, a religion is a cult with a state.” The conversation is so much fun that Corinna, Nina, and Derrick form a little cult of their own! Derrick Jensen’s website: https://derrickjensen.org/ Bright Green Lies: https://www.brightgreenlies.com/book
01:14:33
September 21, 2021
Return of the Fox
Returning guest Angus Fox calls our interview with Grace Lavery a “public service to Philosophy.” Nina offers a “forever home” for Corinna as a “pet trans,” keeping his food and water dishes filled and even letting him run off leash occasionally. Then the Dorx discuss testoterone, chemical castration, Alan Turing, male vs female detransitioner communities, socialization theory, and euphemisms like “hormone replacement,” “gender affirmation surgery” and “trans kids.” Angus asserts a moral obligation to mock, and Corinna recalls being felt up by his first endocrinologist, whom he describes as “a cross between Dr. Ruth and Dr. Frankenstein.” Women are overrepresented in “trans medicine” surgery, compared to surgery as a whole; Nina wants to know why. All that and more in a mere hour and twenty seven minutes. Our Grace Lavery episode: https://www.heterodorx.com/podcast/episode-26-trano-a-trano-with-grace-lavery/ Christine Lavin - Sensitive New Age Guys: https://youtu.be/dnKK4ULoMB8 Angus Fox’s Quillette series on transing boys: https://quillette.com/author/angus-fox/ Genspect, a voice for parents with gender-questioning kids: https://genspect.org/ Contact Angus: angus@genspect.org
01:27:12
September 13, 2021
Meghan Murphy and the "Mean Girls" of Feminism
Prominent feminist writer and podcaster Meghan Murphy discusses being attacked not only by typical opponents, but by some feminists too. Feminist Current: https://www.feministcurrent.com/ The Butthurt-Reaction Cycle: https://blog.ninapaley.com/2019/10/31/the-butthurt-reaction-cycle/
46:42
September 01, 2021
Back from Break!
After a 3-week hiatus, Corinna and Nina discuss the book Cynical Theories by Helen Pluckrose and James Lindsay. Nina takes a more nuanced approach to Judith Butler, discovering something she said that isn’t utter nonsense. Corinna questions “misogyny” and “patriarchy,” and challenges Nina’s “feminist lens,” after which Nina tells Corinna to f__k himself. It’s good to be back! Links: Glenn Loury and John McWhorter discuss “What’s Systemic about Systemic Racism?" https://bloggingheads.tv/videos/62356 Cynical Theories by Helen Pluckrose and James Lindsay: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/53052177-cynical-theories?from_search=true&from_srp=true&qid=KkQQGeLMwg&rank=1 T: The Story of Testosterone, the Hormone that Dominates and Divides Us by Carole Hooven: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/53138024-t?from_search=true&from_srp=true&qid=w99uXfWC9E&rank=1 The Righteous Mind: Why Good People Are Divided by Politics and Religion by Jonathan Haidt: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/11324722-the-righteous-mind?from_search=true&from_srp=true&qid=ieRWcm8zhB&rank=1 Trans: When Ideology Meets Reality by Helen Joyce: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/56897445-trans?from_search=true&from_srp=true&qid=P6HMcwJBU0&rank=1
51:46
August 24, 2021
America’s Most Undercompensated Detranssexual with Grace Lidinsky-Smith
Just one week after interviewing someone else with the same first name and last initial, the Dorx chat with the totally different, not-to-be-confused-with Grace Lidinsky-Smith: writer, female detransitioner, and President of GCCAN, the Gender Care Consumer Advocacy Network. Because both Grace and Corinna were assigned nerd at birth, they talk about Renaissance Faires, including Corinna’s Victor-Victoria-esque plan to wear “male garb” at his next one. Then Nina becomes a jock because both nerds regard her as one. Grace asks if Nina is “naturally high-T,” and Nina realizes she’s never had her hormone levels tested, but she praises menopause and disparages youth. Corinna introduces Heterodorx Poetry Time by reading Little Abigail and the Beautiful Pony by Shel Siverstein. The mood remains light even as Grace talks about having her nipples put back on lopsided after her double mastectomy, because people who have been through heavy shit use humor to cope. Grace Lidinsky-Smith on Twitter: https://twitter.com/HormoneHangover Grace Lidinsky-Smith’s substack: https://hormonehangover.substack.com/ Little Abigail and the Beautiful Pony by Shel Silverstein: https://allpoetry.com/Little-Abigail-and-the-Beautiful-Pony
54:28
July 26, 2021
Trano-a-Trano with Grace Lavery
Corinna arranges a conversation with Grace Lavery, associate professor at UC Berkeley and outspoken trans activist. The result is almost as limitless and formless as what a "woman" is. Grace Lavery: https://english.berkeley.edu/profiles/386
01:22:45
July 22, 2021
Homosexual Heterodorkery with Angus Fox
The Dorx welcome funny and charming writer Angus Fox, whose recent work focuses on the transing of boys. Because they both have described their younger selves as the type of boy likely to identify as trans today, Nina asks why Corinna transitioned and Angus did not. This begins a discussion of the influence of internet chatrooms and media, how masculine men exclude their effeminate brothers, and the role of girls in transing boys. Angus wonders how much misogynistic genderism is explained by the prevalence of porn, and how much is because boys are idiots. Nina goes out on a limb and claims men are human, while Corinna and Angus further alienate our feminist listeners by blaming women for “gender woo.” It’s a refreshing twist on the usual “kill all the men” sentiment, and as heterodorx as two homosexual men can be. Angus Fox’s Quillette series on transing boys: https://quillette.com/author/angus-fox/ Genspect, a voice for parents with gender-questioning kids: https://genspect.org/ Contact Angus: angus@genspect.org
01:15:31
July 13, 2021
Olympic Sarcasm
The Heterodorx co-horses are eager to compete in the Olympics, in either Equestrian Tennis or Sarcasm. Nina realizes if she identifies as a man, her bicycling performance will improve by 22% - it’s science! After an adorable interruption by Nina’s cat, Corinna shares some reader feedback and Nina disparages elective cosmetic surgery. Finally, a discussion about COVID, Long COVID, vaccine skepticism, preference falsification, and Voluntary Human Extinction end the podcast on a typically high note. Nina’s cat Lola: https://youtu.be/t89bGOrWmew The Voluntary Human Extinction Movement: http://vhemt.org/
40:41
July 08, 2021
Trash Talk
Corinna and Nina discuss trashing, which is what feminists called canceling before there was canceling. Nina admits she performs gender, but not enough to be “ladyike.” When the topic suddenly pivots to antinatalism, Nina declares herself a species traitor but not a class traitor. Corinna claims to be a “human ally,” and points out that when it comes to male sterilization, there is a vas deferens between half- and full commitment. Is our primary purpose to reproduce, to eat and poop, or something else? So deep, man. TRASHING: The Dark Side of Sisterhood: https://www.jofreeman.com/joreen/trashing.htm THE BABY BOON by Elinor Burkett: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/7397.The_Baby_Boon
40:48
June 28, 2021
Karen Davis Isn't Kidding
The Dorx welcome musician, teacher, YouTuber, and gender-critical feminist Karen Davis to discuss funeral homes, fetishes, firing, and fun. It’s a characteristically lively conversation for Karen, whose YouTube channel is at https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCYj9xEuFEQORfVK3k1kPxQw Enjoy!
01:17:26
June 21, 2021
What If We Win?
The Dorx celebrate Maya Forstater’s Free Speech victory in the UK. Are the ideological tides finally turning? Nina contemplates the dissolution of friendships if the pressure of fighting against insanity is lifted. Corinna worries that Gender Critical extremists will “go after trans people.” This gradually leads to an argument about the Aimee Stephens case, in which a funeral home employee was fired for being trans - or was it for being male and violating the dress code? A TERF vs. Tranny conflict ensues, as the Dorx fail, but sincerely try, to understand each other. But in the end they are united by their common commitment to liberty, as well as their mysteriously off-putting personalities. Maya Forstater wins: https://web.archive.org/web/20210611082614/https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/06/10/maya-forstaters-victory-injects-good-sense-toxic-trans-debate/ MK Fain fired in 2019: https://4w.pub/fired-for-feminism/ WoLF’s amicus brief in the Aimee Stephens case: https://www.supremecourt.gov/DocketPDF/18/18-107/112909/20190820130044873_WoLF%20Amicus%20Harris%20v%20EEOC%20as%20filed.pdfWoLF’s page discussing it: https://www.womensliberationfront.org/news/domoavbcjg7trx092iyjgk9r7c9rpq
53:20
June 13, 2021
True Trans, Good Trans, TRUSCUM, Authentic Trans, Imitation Crab, and Basketballs
The sarcasm flows like California wine as Nina and Corinna tilt their heads and discuss what the heck “true trans” might mean. On the subject of “passing,” Nina forgets to mention this quote, often attributed to PT Barnum, that sums up her position: "You can fool all the people some of the time and some of the people all the time, but you cannot fool all the people all the time." Then, in a dazzling display of creativity, the Dorx think of an improved Inclusive Flag that can be incorporated into fashionable shirts, and conceive a Charlotte Clymer Memorial statue. Nina looks forward to attending an upcoming women’s-only gathering in Michigan, while Corinna recalls having dined with not one but two future murderers, both of whom just happened to be…Californian. Dana Rivers: https://www.karadansky.com/state-v-dana-rivers-updates The Californians: https://youtu.be/dCer2e0t8r8
39:60
June 07, 2021
Serious Sixty and Sarcasmagoria
In this special episode (they’re ALL special! And valid!) the opening Heterodorx theme song is sung by Corinna, who unwittingly promotes a new LGBT breakfast cereal before discussing a recent episode of 60 Minutes that invoked the fury of Kellogg’s partner GLAAD (along with the ACLU, HRC, and other Men’s Rights activists). Nina cries herself to sleep over Corinna’s tragic and pathetic life; Corinna identifies as an Aquarius while Nina is Astro-nonconforming; and the Dorx are stumped by a puzzling question on Corinna’s tennis lesson application. 60 Minutes “State Bills Would Curtail Health Care For Transgender Youth”: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/transgender-health-care-60-minutes-2021-05-23/ Corinna on Femsplainers (second half): https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/when-sons-become-daughters-part-one/id1366430955?i=1000522118038 GCCAN: https://www.gccan.org/
42:53
June 01, 2021
A Black Band-Aid for White Guilt with Chris Waites
Chris Waites is an Amateur Open-Mic Comedian, professional Grocery Shelf-Stocker, mild-mannered provocateur, and self-described “Nobody”. After sorting out Chris’s pronouns, the Dorx discuss BANDAIDGATE. Are “regular” Band-Aids “white”? Are “black” Band-Aids “black”? Are any humans the same color as Band-Aids? What happens when a black man questions the wisdom of chocolate band-aids on fecebook? Nina suggests “fitting in” is a neoliberal Capitalist plot, while Chris learns he is "privileged" to not have to think about race constantly, unlike his long-suffering liberal white allies. The Dorx also discuss how people suppress their individuality within tribes; the difference between allies and friends; “Golem-ing”; getting drunk on White Guilt; and Corinna’s Black Power Fist facial tattoo. BandAidGate: https://www.facebook.com/nina.paley/posts/10159803364887642 Square Pegs theme song: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldkNnT1SuvE The Age of White Guilt by Shelby Steele: https://blog.ninapaley.com/2019/08/18/the-age-of-white-guilt-and-the-disappearance-of-the-black-individual-by-shelby-steele/
52:05
May 24, 2021
The Dorx Don't Save The World
Our more-or-less Jewish hosts share their sub-optimally-informed opinions about conflict in the Middle East. Perhaps the colonization of Palestine could be resisted by misgendering Israelis? But first, Corinna talks about why Ellen DeGeneres doesn’t belong in Hollywood. Later, Corinna plugs Target’s new queer-branded product line, and threatens to buy Nina an “ALLY” t-shirt. Corinna is propositioned in Corinna’s ‘hood (notice how I’m avoiding pronouns here? awkward!), and donates to Nina’s MysicSymbolic project by mistaking it for a transition fund. Throughout, the Dorx’s extreme and relentless sarcasm makes much of the discussion incomprehensible to anyone but them. Enjoy! links: This Land Is Mine: https://vimeo.com/50531435 MysticSymbolic crowdfunder: https://www.gofundme.com/f/mysticsymbolic-development Andrea Dworkin on the Sexual Revolution: https://blog.ninapaley.com/2019/08/23/andrea-dworkin-on-the-sexual-revolution/
46:18
May 17, 2021
Metamodernism with Greg Dember
Metamodernism is a response to Postmodernism, which is a response to Modernism, which is a response to Traditionalism. The Dorx discuss that and more with Greg Dember, one of Metamodernism’s leading experts. Nina wants to know if her movies Sita Sings the Blues and Seder-Masochism are metamodern, and Greg obliges with an answer! (Spoiler: yes.) After Nina compares metamodernist media to porn, using the metaphor of “the money shot,” Greg suggests she might have her very own episteme. Corinna identifies as post-postmodernist, which is another way to say 'irredeemably sarcastic'. In spite of the Dorx’s cynicism (postmodern) and their guest’s optimism (metamodern), they enjoy a fun, fruitful, intellectual conversation, and conclude, “identity is the metamodern problem.” https://whatismetamodern.com
01:08:07
May 10, 2021
With Allies Like These, Who Needs Axes?
This lighthearted, rollicking episode opens with Nina posting Corinna’s rant “Against Allies” (from last week’s episode) on fecebook, to the chagrin of some “allies”. (The next day, Nina gets a 24-hour fecebook ban for “hate speech.”) Then Nina and Corinna discuss the political indoctrination, or lack thereof, of their respective childhoods. They go on to cover how advocacy groups reduce diversity, the discovery of a “third race,” the retraction of Richard Dawkins’ decades-old Humanist award, the idolization of the Gender Unicorn, and whether “It’s Always OK to Ask Someone Their Gender Pronouns!” Finally, they segue into “Meta-Modernism,” the topic of next week’s episode. Fun! Four Arguments For The Elimination of Television by Jerry Mander: http://www.nelligennet.com/televisionjerrymander.pdf
34:35
May 03, 2021
Against Allies
This week's mercifully short episode opens with both Nina and Corinna exhausted from dealing with Internet bullshit. Corinna talks about being drawn into the manipulative abuse of a transphobic gay man on Clubhouse. Nina reminisces about an organization that used to exist to help poor women have access to reproductive health resources. In between, Corinna goes on a magnificent rant against "allies," which should be bronzed for posterity. If you listen to only 2 minutes of Heterodorx, start at 08:00 of this episode.
22:02
April 26, 2021
Dorking Out With Jayson Graham
Note: This special episode is presented principally in the Russian language. This week Nina and Corinna talk with Corinna’s old friend, Jayson Graham. We talk about the process of marketing creative works, the role copyright may (or may not) play in establishing one’s marketability, and whether or not social media might be destroying America. The M. Jayson Graham Show https://anchor.fm/m-jayson-graham-show/
46:52
April 19, 2021
Kickin’ it Old-Skool with Miranda F@%#*&g Yardley
Corinna and Nina enjoy a delightful conversation with stunning and brave intelligent and funny transsexual Miranda Yardley, author of such memorable bons mots as, "lighten up trannies, this used to be fun" and "a quick note on pronouns: I don't give a shit." While Miranda and Corinna recall alarming changes in the trans community over recent decades, Nina sadistically oppresses both of them with her cishet privilege. Joking aside, Miranda has been the target of some extreme bullshit, online and more importantly in the English courts, and shares some war stories here. Miranda's blog: https://mirandayardley.com/en/ Nina's 1997 appearance (as "Grace,"with the Church of Euthenasia) on Jerry Springer: https://vimeo.com/manage/videos/235654079
59:38
April 12, 2021
Anger Management for Online Stupidity
Nina discusses how she manages rage with the heat of a thousand suns triggered by Internet bullshit she shouldn’t care that much about. Corinna confesses to some high-running emotions after an encounter with bullshit on the new app Clubhouse. At 27:35 Nina mis-sexes a male who is definitely not a pedophile, and at 32:00 she goes on an important rant against coerced pronouns. Finally, she declares a new identity as a CERC (pronounced “curse”). Graham Linehan’s substack: https://grahamlinehan.substack.com/ Nina’s argument tweets: https://spinster.xyz/@ninapaley/posts/A5jcIonm22fqw6apVo
39:23
April 03, 2021
I.P. Everywhere! Featuring Guest Heterodork Stephan Kinsella
Get ready for some hardcore Libertarian nerd-talk, as Corinna goes head-to-head with Stephan Kinsella, Libertarianism’s foremost critic of copyright and patents and author of Against Intellectual Property. Thrill to dazzling theories of labor vs. action, restrictive covenants, negative easements, burdened estates, nuisances, limitations, consent, redistribution of rights, triangular intervention, property, scarcity, value, allocation of contestable resources, conflict, trade secrets, the Patent Bargain, disclosure, distortion, abolishing the FDA…wait, what? By the end of the episode, Corinna suffers a long-overdue crisis of faith. SUCCESS! Related links: Stephan Kinsella, Against Intellectual Property C4SIF.org Resources http://c4sif.org/resources/ Intellectual Property Rights as Negative Servitudes Karl Fogel: The Surprising History of Copyright and The Promise of a Post-Copyright World and https://youtu.be/mhBpI13dxkI Boldrin & Levine, Against Intellectual Monopoly “Conversation with an author about copyright and publishing in a free society” (Harry Potter example) “Intellectual Property” as an umbrella term and as propaganda: a reply to Richard Stallman A Selection of Kinsella’s Best Articles and Speeches on IP
01:16:52
March 29, 2021
Heterodorx Gets Schooled by MK Fain
Corinna and Nina discover what happens when they interview someone more articulate than either of them: MK Fain, the youthful Doyenne of feminist social media. She is the founder of Spinster.xyz, co-founder of Ovarit, publisher of 4w.pub, and co-host of the Identity Crisis podcast. We touch on free speech and pornography, and its upcoming technology frontier. As the discussion goes into intellectual property, MK corrects Corinna’s misconceptions of who really benefits from copyrights. Find MK on Spinster: https://spinster.xyz/@mk Copyright is Brain Damage: https://youtu.be/XO9FKQAxWZc
57:47
March 22, 2021
Guest Heterodork Alex Gleason, the Johnny Appleseed of Social Networks
Heterodorx welcomes its first guest, serial social network creator Alex Gleason. Alex created Soapbox.FE, the software running feminist social media platform spinster.xyz and Nina’s own neenster.org, among others. His next project, Tribes, aims to make it easy and painless for anyone to start their own fediverse server by pushing a few buttons. The Dorx cover technology, the sociology of social networks, and adamantly avoid talking about the weather. You can find Alex at his fediverse server, gleasonator.com.
39:43
March 13, 2021
©ommunity $tandards
What’s the difference between “community standards” and censorship? How do we determine what books to include and exclude from libraries? Why does the Dr. Seuss estate get to decide what Dr. Seuss books stay in print? Is copyright censorship, as Nina asserts? What’s the difference between plagiarism and copyright violation? In an uncharacteristically focused and coherent conversation, Nina and Corinna discuss these questions and more. Then, Jesse and Katie chip in with some ideas on how to close each episode. The Surprising History of Copyright and The Promise of a Post-Copyright World by Karl Fogel: https://questioncopyright.org/promise The Internet Archive vs the Authors Guild: https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20200330/18125844202/publishers-authors-misguided-freakout-over-internet-archives-decision-to-enable-more-digital-book-checkouts-during-pandemic.shtml For 30 Years, I’ve Tried to Become a Woman. Here’s What I Learned Along the Way by Nina Paley: https://quillette.com/2020/06/22/for-30-years-ive-tried-to-become-a-woman-heres-what-i-learned-along-the-way/ Copyright is Brain Damage, a 2015 talk by Nina: https://youtu.be/XO9FKQAxWZc
38:50
March 07, 2021
The Gender Critical Movement is Dead. Long Live the Gender Critical Movement!
Nina considers the history of creepy fetishists in comics, leading to a discussion about “perverts” and attempts to normalize them to children. Then Nina blathers about Eunuchs for a while. Suddenly, Corinna takes the conversation in a different direction by declaring the Gender Critical Movement over. This gradually leads to a scrappy argument filled with tension and suspense! Who wins? Listen and find out! Women’s Human Rights Campaign: https://www.womensdeclaration.com/en/about/ Save Women’s Sports: https://savewomenssports.com/
38:52
February 28, 2021
Personality Disorders Are Valid
Nina gets a GitHub account, and the first thing she worries about is whether a mob will cancel her there. Corinna debates coming out as non-binary. Is "human" a gender, or still a species? After some discussion, we agree that all identities, tribal affiliations, cult memberships, and personality disorders are valid, so please don't cancel us. Nina's new art/software project: https://blog.ninapaley.com/2021/02/17/mystic-symbolic-the-developening/
24:46
February 22, 2021
TERF-War Inside Baseball and Rural Intersectionality
Trans-identified female Scott Newgent, who just released an important (dare we say heroic) article in Newsweek, is praised by Nina on feminist social media site Spinster.xyz, only to be met with harsh criticism from radical feminists who argue trans gender critics must detransition to be taken seriously. TERF-war inside baseball continues as Corinna brings up the Biden Administration’s endorsement of boys in girls’ sports. Corinna suggests drawing a Rural/City axis into Intersectionality, to which Nina responds cynically. Nina is in fact unusually cynical and sarcastic throughout, perhaps because she’s being cancelled by yet another cultural institution, again. Scott Newgent’s Newsweek article: https://www.newsweek.com/we-need-balance-when-it-comes-gender-dysphoric-kids-i-would-know-opinion-1567277 Nina’s Spinster discussion: https://spinster.xyz/@ninapaley/posts/A46xiOMs4d8Ur7maJ6 Newsweek article on Biden’s exec order/boys in girl’s sports/trans rights are human rights pr: https://www.newsweek.com/fact-check-does-bidens-executive-order-allow-transgender-athletes-compete-gender-their-1563790 Original Atlantic piece that evolved into the Coddling of the American Mind https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/09/the-coddling-of-the-american-mind/399356/
36:26
February 13, 2021
Everyone Expects the Spanish Inquisition
For no reason in particular, Corinna wants to talk about the Spanish Inquisition, which was originally the Inquisition of Heretical Depravity. Since we strictly forbid any form of heresy in this safe space, it hardly makes sense on why the Inquisition would be germane. In completely different news, Corinna and Nina talk about the New York Times parting ways with David McNeal, its foremost science reporter, after he was overheard uttering a blasphemous word in the company of children from wealthy families. Nina talks about the importance of courage, especially as it reflects on mental health, and Corinna challenges the idea of whether courage even exists. New York Times fires Donald McNeil: https://news.yahoo.com/ny-times-star-reporter-fired-214228379.html Shelby Steele’s documentary “What Killed Michael Brown” https://whatkilledmichaelbrown.com
56:55
February 07, 2021
Senator is a Slur
After discussing some feedback on Episode 1, corinnA and ninA use the word "senator" as a slur. They name some other slurs, so listener discretion is advised. corinnA asserts the importance of Liberal Democracy, while ninA implies they don't live in one. Then ninA shares some details about a Very Retarded Breakup, and corinnA invites listeners to send feedback to info@heterodorx.com , or comment at https://www.heterodorx.com/uncategorized/episode-2/ Note: ninA's mic sounds pretty bad here. She will return to her USB desktop mic in our next episode.
38:54
February 06, 2021
TERF vs. Tranny
Corinna and Nina make their very first recording together, discussing slurs, radical feminism, pronouns, porn, and more. Corinna dazzles Nina by revealing, superhero-style, that he started what became https://terfisaslur.com/ .  Nina's essay, "My Sex-Positive Memoirs," is at https://4w.pub/sex-pos-memoirs/ Essays on Corinna's original (and anonymous) terfisaslur tumblr: https://terfisaslur.tumblr.com/post/80795200850/terf-is-a-slur https://terfisaslur.tumblr.com/post/79181927909/spiral-of-silence-and-trans-misogyny
45:23
January 31, 2021
Microphones are Things
Nina has mic troubles. Will she buy a whole new microphone? Plus, lots of "transitions" canned music clips between segments!
02:47
January 26, 2021
Hey Stoners...
Nina tries to think and talk at the same time. Also, trying out a signature show greeting. What will Corinna think?
04:19
January 26, 2021
Uh, Um, Y'know...
Nina continues exploring musical options on anchor.fm. This was recorded with my new audio splitter, which allows a separate mic and headphones to connect to the same single audio jack on my wee little Macbook Air. 
03:26
January 26, 2021
Double Ungood
Nina checks her recording equipment and learns how anchor.fm works.
04:23
January 21, 2021