The Brown Girl Podcast

In episode 54, Julie speaks with Arshiya Kherani. 

Arshiya is a Leadership Coach who partners with rising leaders with hyphenated backgrounds through her program, Niyah Coaching. She is a storyteller & entrepreneur at heart, and is a Co-Founder at Potluck Stories, an LA-based community organization that hosts monthly interactive storytelling events that amplifies underrepresented voices. 

Tune in to hear Arshiya walk us through the various twists and turns she's encountered in her 20s and continues to navigate in her 30s. 

You'll gain insights into:

• Overcoming the grip of  fear
• Finding your confidence
• The art of living with intention and finding your north star
• How to lean into the narrative of  "you're doing too much"
• Embracing pivoting and change in life's direction

Thank you to SPONSOR:

Pajama Sutra, a South Asian owned loungewear brand on a mission to inspire women to lounge like a goddess. PajamaSutra offers an exquisite range of loungewear that includes robes, kaftans, rompers, pajamas, and matching mommy and me sets, that bring luxury to your everyday life. 

In episode 53, Julie speaks with Jenova Juliann Pryor on her Blindian relationship journey.  

In Episode 51, Julie records a solo episode diving into 5 habits she adopted in 2023 that she will carry into 2024.

1. Time Management Hacks - The Two Minute Rule and the Pomodoro Method
2. Maxing out my 401k contributions and Increasing all my other general investments
3. Nighttime routine 
4. Blocking use of social media apps in the morning
5. Normalizing delayed text messages

Resources discussed:

In episode 50, Julie speaks with relationship coach Natasha Mahtani. 

Natasha is a certified Relationship Coach and accredited Divorce Coach.

Coming from a South Asian background and having lived in Liberia, England, Nigeria, Ireland, India, Hong Kong and Taiwan,  she understands the cultural nuances within relationships and more specifically, the limiting narratives and beliefs that surface in relationships across many cultures.

Natasha helps women of color, globally, to increase their sense of self-worth, show up for themselves, identify and rewire their limiting beliefs and thrive in all relationships.

We discuss the following:

• Misconceptions of what it take to have a healthy relationship
• Warning signs that a relationship may be heading in an unhealthy direction
• Communication vs comprehension
• Maintaining adventure and novelty and preventing the relationship from becoming stale
• Balancing personal space and togetherness in a relationship
• Social media and the impact on couples
• Supporting each other when facing external pressures and work related challenges
• Importance of forgiveness and how to build trust when trust is breached

Thank you to our sponsors:

In episode 48, Julie meets again with Shital Patel, known for her appearances on Indian Matchmaking (IMM) Season 2 and Season 3. 

Shital originally came on our podcast in 2022 and I'm so thrilled to have her back today. 

In this episode, Shital opens up about life post IMM Season 3.

We mainly discuss the ending of the relationship that we saw on TV; what she learned through it, how she healed from the breakup, the challenges and unique aspects of navigating such a personal experience being in the public eye, and what she's looking forward to the most as she enters her 40s.

Thank you to our SPONSORS:

In episode 47, Julie meets with her Fall in MalayaLove (FIM) co-founder, Matt George to discuss details and behind the scenes of planning the first ever FIM Speed Dating event for Malayalee Christians. Tune in to hear Matt and Julie discuss the following: 

• Origin story and why they started FIM
• Initial fears or uncertainties regarding whether there would be enough interest
• Negative reactions or backlash from the community 
• Finances associated with the event 
• Success metrics of matching from the event
• Feedback from participants and things they would have done differently 
• The volunteer team, who they are, and team memories
• Biz relationship dynamics between Matt and Julie
• Future of FIM

In episode 46, Julie meets with her friend Rachel Varkey, also the host of the It's Fine Podcast with Rachel Varkey.

Rachel opens up about her experiences with infertility and the various treatment options she underwent to pursue a path toward motherhood. We learn about:

• Rachel's background and desires for motherhood growing up
• Process she underwent with IUI and IVF and what you can expect
• Impact of infertility on her marriage and how she and her husband coped
• Advice for those who are struggling with conception
• How we can create a more supportive and empathetic community for those struggling with fertility

Thank you to our episode SPONSOR:

Manthrakodi Weddings | The destination for Malayalee Christian weddings

In episode 44, Julie chats with Annika Sharma. 

Annika is co-founder and co-host of That Desi Spark podcast, one of the largest independently run South Asian podcasts in the world, which has led to appearances on the BBC, Forbes, and on a Spotify billboard campaign. 

Annika is also an author and her debut romcom novel, “Love, Chai, and Other Four-Letter Words,” the first in the Chai Masala Club series, earned starred reviews from the Library Journal and BookList, and was described as a “love letter to both Indian culture and the streets of New York City,” by Publisher’s Weekly. It was named an Amazon Editors’ Pick and Apple Books called Annika a “Writer to Watch.” Her second book of the series, “Sugar, Spice, and Can’t Play Nice,” released May 2, 2023.

She currently lives in the New York City area. She is a lover of long conversations, superhero movies, reading, and travel.

Tune in to hear Julie and Annika chat about:

• Her childhood & growing up in State College, PA
• Various careers paths + becoming a writer 
• Insight into the world of book writing, connecting with publishing houses & editors
• Dealing w/ rejection and creative blocks  
• Becoming a new mom + pregnancy 
• Using Social media as a creative while also upholding certain boundaries on what she does and doesn’t want to share, so I really loved hearing take on it.  

In Episode 43, Julie chats w/ Arti Lalwani from Netflix's latest Season 3 of Indian Matchmaking.

You might remember her from a quick appearance in Season 2, but now she's back and sharing even more of her story in Season 3.

Tune in to hear Julie and Arti chat about:

• How the opportunity for Indian Matchmaking came up
• Arti's experience being on Indian Matchmaking and working with Sima Aunty
• When she decided to start prioritizing finding love after focusing on her career for so long
• Meeting Jamal + their initial Costco and Breakfast dates
• What she loves most about Jamal + how they prioritize and invest in their relationship as a couple
• Wedding planning!

Thank you to our Sponsors, Sonu Company! Sonu Company is a premium jewelry company that shares a commitment to high quality craftmanship.  Sonu was founded by two South Asian sisters, Payal and Kajal Vitha!

Their goal is to educate customers in their buying journey while also retaining their commitment to sustainability and transparency.

In this episode, Julie chats w/ Bobby Seagull from Netflix's Indian Matchmaking Season 3. 

If you watched the show, you know Bobby is filled with loads of enthusiasm and excitement for life, especially for the subject Math!  

Prior to Indian Matchmaking, Bobby has appeared several times on British television, including the quiz show University Challenge and the BBC documentary series Monkman & Seagull's Genius Guide to Britain.

Bobby's passion for improving math literacy is evidenced through frequent appearances on various broadcast and radio programs throughout the UK, as well as by authoring several books on the subject.

Tune in to hear Bobby and Julie chat about Bobby's:

• Upbringing in the UK
• Experience being on Indian Matchmaking and working with Sima Aunty
• The infamous salsa dancing shoes
• His prior dating and relationship history + the dating apps he uses.
• His thoughts on dating outside the South Asian culture
• Friend-zoning & dealing with rejection
• His reactions to some of the not-so-nice feedback he's  received from the internet and TV audiences about his portrayal on the show. 

Thank you to our Sponsors, Sonu Company! They also made an appearance on Indian Matchmaking Season 3. Sonu Company is a premium jewelry company that shares a commitment to high quality craftmanship.  Sonu was founded by two South Asian sisters, Payal and Kajal Vitha!

Their goal is to educate customers in their buying journey while also retaining their commitment to sustainability and transparency.

In Episode 41, Julie chats w/ Aishwarya Balaji, founder and CEO of A Fresh Sip

Aishwarya is a serial entrepreneur who is experienced and passionate about building businesses in alignment with personal values and  goals

In Episode 40, Julie speaks with Shilpa Cacho. 

In this episode, we get raw and real on the topic of infidelity, divorce, eloping, and ultimately finding freedom and authentic living.

We know these are highly stigmatized topics in the South Asian community. Thank you, Shilpa for sharing your story so candidly.

Shilpa shares with us:

• her experiences going through divorce from her first husband
• the infidelity that occurred on her marriage
• underlying mental and emotional issues that she was going through 
• tips and advice for women on dating post divorce
• how she met her now husband, Isaac
• how they maintain a thriving relationship today

THANK YOU to our Sponsor, Azhar PR

Azhar PR is a Public Relations & Digital Marketing agency founded by Amber Sabri. Her agency is dedicated to amplifying female founders, minority-owned brands, and South Asian-owned brands through the power of PR.

In Episode 39, Julie speaks with married couple, Shelly Sood and Nikhil Torsekar.

Shelly Sood is an author, speaker, mother of 3, wife, and entrepreneur. Her husband of 20 years, Nikhil, had suffered from undiagnosed bipolar disorder for two decades, leading to massive devastation emotionally, mentally, and financially. After helping to save his life and their marriage, Shelly launched a healthcare company (GIOSTAR* Chicago) and discovered the fulfillment gained from diminishing the pain of others.

After becoming suicidal, and ultimately getting diagnosed at the age of 40, Nikhil Torsekar began a journey of introspection and healing, and is now a devoted husband, dedicated parent, and thriving professional. He runs The Untether Your Life Podcast, serves as Director of Marketing for GIOSTAR Chicago, and is a tireless mental health advocate. His journey of discovery and healing through higher states of consciousness led he and his wife Shelly to incorporate Mindvalley’s personal growth platform into their own lives. Nikhil has a BA from Washington University, an MS from DePaul University, and an MBA from The University of Chicago.

In Episode 38, we are delving into the journey of more trailblazing South Asians. Julie speaks with Tina Singh.

Tina is an occupational therapist, digital content creator, mom of 3, and most recently, an entrepreneur.

In Episode 37, Julie shares her tangent thoughts on paid dating apps. Then she shares a few memorable online dating stories, including the time she got stood up,  got called a psycho, and had an interesting DM on Offer Up.

In episode 35, Julie speaks with Dee Gautham.

Dee is the founder and CEO of The Boss Body Revolution, a health coaching company with a mission to help women transform their confidence through fitness and health. Julie and Dee discuss Dee's background and how she got into health coaching, why South Asians have a harder time adhering to fitness and nutrition, myths that exist around diet culture, and tips and advice for you to get your health and nutrition in order in 2023!

Julie records a solo episode reflecting on turning 32. She talks through some changes she's made in 2022, a few of her personal goals/intentions for 2023 , and also answers some of the questions submitted via IG question box. Questions include skincare routines, tips for maintaining weight loss goals into the new year, and what has surprised her the most about being a podcaster. 

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In episode 33, Julie talks with Renee Kar Johnson! Renee works full time in Product Management, is currently doing her MBA at the University of Chicago, AND is the founder and CEO of RKJ Designs, which is an Indo western fashion line that focuses on clothing that can be worn anytime but with a desi twist.

In this episode, Julie and Renee talk about :

• Renee's background and upbringing as half Malayalee half Bengali
• How her interest in fashion and design began
• What it was like showcasing her collection at the first ever South Asian New York Fashion Week      (SANYFW)
• The current state of diversity and inclusion in the fashion and modeling space
• What Renee is specifically  doing to hold herself accountable as a Designer for ensuring inclusivity and sustainability within her line
• How YOU can get involved if you're interesting in modeling for her line 

GET IN TOUCH WITH US

CONNECT WITH RENEE

In Episode 32, Julie has guest Khel Baldeo on the show. Julie discovered Khel through a TikTok video that Khel's friend made about Khel.  Khel is a 46 year old Desi woman who is engaged to her Caucasian fiancé, Mike, who is 30! 

In this episode, Julie and Khel discuss Khel's 16 year age relationship, including the following:

• How Khel and Mike met.
• How their families reacted
• How their social circles are impacted by their age gap
• Fears Khel has surrounding their age gap and long term future
• Khel's relationship history
• IVF and fertility journey

GET IN TOUCH WITH US :

CONNECT WITH KHEL

In Episode 31, Julie speaks with Ayaan Dalal. Ayaan is a South Asian transgender man.

In this episode, Julie and Ayaan talk about:

• Ayaan's upbringing and how he first discovered he didn’t identify with the female sex assigned at birth
• Navigating telling his family and social circles
• Lifestyle changes he's made to support his transition (dietary, clothing, home décor, etc)
• Medical surgeries he will be undergoing
• Dating /relationships and future fertility options
• Dos/Don’t's of interacting with trans people and ways we can show our support

If you feel compelled to support Ayaan in his transition journey, please see this GoFundMe

In Ep 28, Julie speaks with Self Worth & Dating Coach Sy Neary. They discuss: 

• The Energetics of Dating  --> What is Masculine Energy vs Feminine energy and the role it plays in relationships (and life)
• Why the traits that make you successful in your careers may not be helping your dating life
• Why you keep attracting unavailable men
• Red flags + green flags of dating
• Moving from the "talking" phase" to the dating phase
• How to avoid getting attached too quickly
• Human Design readings - what are they and how can they be beneficial

#thebrowngirlpodcast #datingpodcast #datingadviceforwomen #southasiandating

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In Episode 27, we are talking about Solo Traveling! Whether you need inspiration for your first solo trip or you're a seasoned traveler getting that itch to book your next trip, you will appreciate this episode with guest Veena Murali. 

Veena is a 22-year-old Indian-American woman who is passionate about inspiring people to travel intentionally and venture outside their comfort zones. Born and raised in the suburbs of Chicago, she moved to New York City for her undergraduate education, where she caught the travel bug after studying abroad in Prague, Czech Republic. Knowing that she wanted to prioritize travel as a tool for education, Veena graduated a semester early with a plan to travel the world solo for six months. Her trip spanned six months, five continents, and nearly thirty countries and changed the way she sees the world around her.

Julie and Veena discuss:

• Veena's experiences traveling abroad including her study abroad along with a separate 6 month solo adventure after graduation.
• How she managed to budget and save money to do so
• How she combatted loneliness while traveling alone
• Safety precautions and advice for avoiding unwanted attention as a female
• Ways in which travel has shaped her perspectives on life in her own country and others
• Misconceptions that people have about solo traveling
• Advice for people wanting to explore solo traveling

GET IN TOUCH WITH US :

In episode 26, Julie is joined by Subrina K Singh to discuss mental health within the South Asian Community, and specifically what it's like to live with bipolar disorder.

Subrina was diagnosed with bipolar disorder when she was 16 and shares her mental health journey as a way to support, advocate, and create awareness for mental health.

Tune in to this episode to hear:

• Subrina's diagnosis story & symptoms and events leading up to her diagnosis
• How her condition impacted her college journey & how she learned to navigate
• Her experience spending time in various mental health facilities and how that looks different than what we often see portrayed on TV
• Misconceptions about bipolar and mental health conditions
• What microaggressions look and sound like toward people with bipolar and how we can use language that is more inclusive
• How we can support loved ones who may live with bipolar or other mental health conditions

Mental Health Support Groups

In this episode, we are talking about BREAKUPS…

Breakups by all means suck. A breakup season can be filled with grief of losing someone, sadness, feelings of loneliness, and possibly guilt or rejection depending on the circumstances or the reasons for breakup. 

Whether you're the heartbreaker or the one being broken up with, it won't be easy and it can take some time to adjust and learn to live without this person.

In this episode, Julie first shares her own personal breakup story, and her journey of healing and moving on. Then we listen to a few breakup stories submitted by listeners as well and talk through each one.

Stay tuned for Part 2 where we discuss breakups with a guest and answer breakup questions submitted by listeners.

GET IN TOUCH WITH US :

Have you ever wondered why every election feels like a massive existential crisis ?

Or why it feels so difficult to pass laws that would seemingly satisfy the needs of most Americans (e.g. basic laws to make gun ownership more safe, restrict gun access to unstable people, etc)

In Episode 21, Julie talks with recipe queen Ramya Ravuri!

Ramya is the mastermind behind the popular food blog EatsByRamya and is known for her series "Cooking Basics for 20 Somethings" where she breaks down cooking for beginners.

She's a data scientist by profession, a food blogger by passion, and someone who loves to be involved in a lot of different activities. Over the last 3 years, Ramya has built her audience across various platforms.

In this episode ,  Ramya and Julie discuss:

• How Ramya got started with food blogging and recipe creation
• How she balanced maintaining the food blog while also being a full time college student & working for a startup
• How her college experience was impacted by the Pandemic
• How many hours (behind the scenes) actually goes into making a 30-60 recipe video
• Her different strategies for posting on TikTok, Instagram,  Youtube, etc
• How she decided her post graduation plans of starting a traditional 9-5 career vs  full time content creation
• Her self care routine and goals she wants to accomplish in her 20s
• Advice she has for other creators or bloggers

GET IN TOUCH WITH US :

In this episode, Julie has guest Shwetha Mangal on the show.

Shwetha is a Mom of two who started her career as a fitness coach at the age of 40. She's a Certified Personal Trainer and Coach with The Boss Body Revolution and loves helping women become their most confident selves.  She grew up in Hyderabad, India and currently lives in Minnesota with her husband and two teens.

In this episode , they discuss Shwetha's:

• Arranged marriage she had at the age of 19, what that process was like, and the journey of that marriage to today
• Parenting style and relationship with her two teenagers
• Growing social media presence, content creation, & the inevitable trolling and bullying that happens when you have a growing audience.
• Starting a career in the world of fitness at the age of 40
• Competing on stage in a bikini competition at the age of 40

GET IN TOUCH WITH US :

In Episode 19, Julie speaks with Disha Mazepa about interracial relationships.  Disha shares her experience dating outside her South Asian community and eventually marrying her Caucasian husband, Mike.  They discuss the following:

• How Disha and her husband met
• Telling the parents about her interracial relationship
• Her past dating history
• Wedding planning and challenges of integrating cultures
• Incorporating religion & culture w/ future kids
• Preserving culture
• What being in an interracial marriage has taught her
• Advice and resources for those in interracial relationships

If you are in an interracial relationship, the below are support resources you can use. 

In Episode 18, Julie speaks with Divorce Attorney Maliha Siddiqui.

Divorce is something that is considered to be very taboo in South Asian communities. It's highly stigmatized and as a result, divorce rates are very low within South Asian populations. Even if there's violence, abuse, or other oppressive situations happening within a household,  the reality of our culture is that the stigma and shame of divorce is so great it often leads people to stay in their married arrangements rather than go through a divorce .

Though we will focus a future episode on individuals who have gone through divorce sharing their experience and overcoming it, today's episode will be informative and educational in nature and discuss Divorce within South Asian communities and legal implications and outcomes of the divorce process.

Julie and Maliha discuss the following :

• Types of divorce cases that are most common within the South Asian community
• Expected divorce timeline and process
• Can you file for divorce without an attorney?
• What happens in situations when one person does not want to comply with the divorce (Hello Kimye ?)
• Mediation
• Costs of divorce
• Parenting vs Financial Categories of Divorce
• How Maintenance aka Alimony payments are calculated
• How Child Support Payments are calculated
• How Marital Estate (assets and debt) are divided
• Joint Community vs Equitable Distribution States
• Prenups and Postnups
• Advice for people who have not broken news to their Spouse that they want to get Divorced
• Unique Circumstances within South Asian divorces (e.g. gold, marital gifts from family,  in-laws involvement, etc)

Connect with Maliha

Facebook

In episode #17,  Julie chats with her friend Danny Matam.  Danny is the first MALE guest on the show! 

While this podcast is and will remain a platform to elevate voices, stories, and perspectives of South Asian women in particular, there are subjects/topics where having a male perspective could be relevant and insightful.  

Tune in to this episode to hear a South Asian male perspective on unconventional career journeys, personal development, dating, relationships, and advice for those seeking love and fulfillment . 

In this episode, we discuss Danny's: 

• Background and why he chose to QUIT corporate America at the age of 28 
• Challenges he's faced during his self employment journey Personal development habits/routines 
• Past romantic relationships and lessons learned What he's looking for in a woman 
• Experience using dating apps and building a good dating profile
• Advice for those seeking love and fulfillment 

#southasiandating #thebrowngirlpodcast #datingforsouthasians #southasian 

Follow Danny on Instagram 

In this episode, Julie has guest Sana Akhand on the show.

Sana is a South Asian female entrepreneur who had a TikTok video that went viral (+1.5M views and counting) a few months ago with when she shared how her and husband are MARRIED and in love but have chosen to live in two SEPARATE NYC apartments.

Listen in on this very fascinating story. Julie and Sana discuss:

• Sana's background and what led to this decision point in her marriage
• How their relationship and love story has improved since deciding to live apart
• What life has been like since the Tiktok video went viral
• What Sana's husband is like
• How they rationalized paying two separate rents
• How their families reacted
• Advice and parting words

Follow Sana's Podcast "Make Your Own Rules"

In this episode, Julie talks with Parween Mander. 

Parween is a South Asian money expert on a mission to provide honest and relatable financial coaching for women of color from immigrant upbringings through 1:1 coaching and mentoring. She built a net worth of $200,000 by the age of 28 and is on a mission to help other WOC overcome their financial traumas and build generational wealth.

Parween is the founder of the Wealthy Wolfe, holds the Accredited Financial Counselor - Canada® designation, and is a certified Trauma of Money Facilitator.

In this episode we discuss:

• Parween's background and her approach for working with clieints
• How Parween created a net worth of $200K by age 28
• What Trauma of money means
• Biggest levers for building wealth
• Relationship between money and power
• Unique money and mindset challenges specific to the South Asian community
• Advice for college students
• Advice for couples on money management, values, and combining finances (or not)

Links

Follow Parween on IG

This is a solo episode.  Julie talks about scams in the world of online dating. Tinder Swindler, anyone? She shares her own experience encountering a fraudster on a dating app, AND we listen to a few stories submitted by other South Asian women.

Please be careful out there and take necessary precautions to protect yourself from being scammed, catfished, or taken advantage of.  Take your time to get to know somebody, use the internet/social media vet people accordingly, do a Facetime or video meeting before you meet in person, and if you have a gut feeling that something feels off, listen to it. 

You can always report fraud here, including romance fraud here:

In this episode, Julie has her friend Tina Luke on the show to discuss dating in their 30s! They chat about their own personal experiences,  cultural pressures around marriage, the endless matrimonial ads and bio-datas from their parents, dating apps , and everything in between.

Stay tuned for Part 2 where they answer Questions submitted by YOU.

Timestamps

00:00 Cultural Expectations & Pressure to Get Married

05:00 Matrimonials and Bio-Datas

12:05 Relationships Won’t Solve Your Existing Problems

15:00 Pressure from Community and Culture Will likely Not Subside

16:28 Take Advantage of Your Single Years - Seriously!!!

23:41 Dating Apps

42:33 Marrying Outside the Culture

To get in touch with us:

This is a solo episode discussing a recap of this year, goal setting for the new year, and ways to level up on 3 pillars - mindset, money, and health, in 2022! We talk about what it means to have a growth mindset, the differences between financial independence & financial literacy and why you need BOTH, as well as small habits and practices you can start implementing to drastically improve your health and well-being. 

If you haven't created goals for 2022, what are you waiting for ?  Listen to this episode, then grab a pen & paper to start planning, prioritizing, and executing for the new year.

Email: julie@theshapeulab.com

In this episode, I interviewed Ambily Jose . Ambily is someone who wears many hats! By day, she is a financial analyst and by night, a model and digital content creator with a growing social media presence and following. Her mission is to spread joy, build one another, and help others feel radiant in their skin while working with brands who share her same mission!

We discuss her own journey of how she got started in the social media and content creation space , some of the fun campaigns she's collaborated on, what it's like behind the scenes with brand partnerships, photoshoots, & compensation. We also discuss how this venture has impacted her own mental health and how she's finding her way to achieving balance and staying collected!

Episode 8 - Rental Property Investing Part 2 Q&A.

This is a follow up episode to Episode 4 - How I Got Into Real Estate Investing and 5 Tips for You

In this episode, I compiled a handful of follow up questions/DMs I received from Episode 4 and address them here. We will discuss:

1. Maintenance issues/expenses & what to expect
2. How to gage how much money to put down as a down payment
3. How you can be cash positive but still show a loss on your tax returns (whereby shielding you from rental income taxes)
4. Methodologies for rent collection and yearly rent increases
5. Understanding your legal responsibilities as a landlord for your particular state or municipality

In this episode, we talk with Crystal Joseph-Cobb, owner and founder of Beauty Marked, a full service luxury hair and makeup services business based out of Tampa, FL.

Crystal shares her experiences from childhood influences,  to starting a side hustle in college, as well as her journey of finishing her MBA, before deciding to turn her passion for beauty into a full time business. Today, Crystal manages a team of 7 artists to offer hair and makeup artist services for weddings, editorials, photoshoots and more, as well as their most recent venture into the beauty branding and marketing space.

Short solo episode where I cover my top 5 favorite wellness products that I've added to my daily routine! These are all products I love and I feel have improved the quality of my life. NOT sponsored or getting paid  - totally unbiased opinion on what has worked well for me :)