The Other Side of Sales

Brynne Tillman, the LinkedIn Whisperer and CEO of Social Sales Link, joins Ashleigh and Ryan to discuss social listening, authenticity, and leaving no connections left behind.

The Rolodex

-When Brynne found LinkedIn over a decade ago, she quickly recognized that it solved her biggest sales struggle, cold calling.

-LinkedIn is a dynamic Rolodex, giving you access to not just your network, but the networks of all your connections.

Social Listening

-Go by the “two under two” rule. Find two things in under two minutes that you can use to connect with a prospect.

-Before you reach out you need to understand who their clients are, the issues they face, and what’s happening in their industry.

Automation

-Ashleigh and Brynne are split on this topic. Brynne advocates for never using automation while Ashleigh advocates for light and strategic use of automation.

Content

-Good content talks to your buyer before they know they need you. You need to know what they are searching for two steps before you come into the process.

Authenticity

-The biggest problem in sales is that there is a dollar amount placed on a prospect prior to the first conversation. And, this is noticeable to the prospect.

-You need to enter the conversation aware that you have to earn the right and add value. Think about what you are worth to the prospect not what the prospect is worth to you.

Connect and Forget

-There is no point in building a Rolodex of people who don’t know who you are. Slow it down, connect personally, and start real conversations.

-Before you do anything, export your connections into an Excel spreadsheet and analyze it. Who are you connected with who you should be leveraging?

Resources

DeJuan Brown, Solution Specialist Director at Microsoft with over 20 years of sales experience, joins Ashleigh and Ryan to talk about career portfolios, authenticity, and self-awareness.

His Sales Journey

-Through a relationship he built while working in the service industry, DeJuan was drawn into sales.

-The first company he joined in a sales role he was at for 12 years before moving on to work in outside sales at Bloomberg. Since then, he has worked in a variety of roles in the sales industry at a wide range of companies.

Career Portfolio

-DeJuan emphasizes following your passion rather than money. Doing this allows you to stay open to conversations, relationships, and experiences.

-You can have success in sales by being regimented and following a linear path. But you can also find it by being creative and freeform. It’s about finding a company that supports you and a product you believe in.

Self-Awareness

-There are many types of sales, so there is no need to stay in a role where you are not finding success or happiness. You have to understand what is or isn’t working for you.

Resources

Ashleigh’s coworker at Duckbill Group, Tim Banks, talks to Ashleigh and Sunanda about the sales engineering world, burnout, and being a person of color in tech.

His Sales Journey

-Tim is a systems engineer by trade but got his start in sales while at a company called Object Rocket. At this company, he started to join sales calls where he both answered technical questions and gathered insight that helped build the product.

Burnout

-There is far too much focus on numbers in the operations and sales worlds. This hyper-fixation of numbers is why so many people leave these industries. Tim left to become a chef for some time.

Being Coin-Operated

-It is okay to be motivated by money. Do not allow companies to take advantage of you. You should be compensated for your work.

Being a Person of Color in Tech

-When Tim first began in tech everyone was preparing for Y2K. Being Black in the 90s tech world meant you could identify with few people. So, Tim learned to codeswitch.

Connect With Tim

Mercy Bell, Executive Producer of the global wellness event Sober Voices, joins Ashleigh and Ryan to talk about turning trauma into your superpower, saving time for yourself, and how to find the right mentor.

Early Trauma

-Trauma experienced early on in life can be harnessed and transformed into a superpower. Mercy developed hypervigilance during her childhood and is now able to use that to observe to bring success.

Duality

-The ability to work hard must be balanced with the ability to slow down. You have to know how to manage your time and resources.

Her Sales Journey

-Mercy started her sales career at 17 when she arrived at Stanford and began working in the call center.

-Though the no’s she received bothered her slightly, she enjoyed fostering meaningful conversations with the few alumni that cared.

Mentors

-The prospecting that is applied to sales can be applied to finding a mentor. You always need people inside and outside of your industry who will support and understand you.

Resources

Roderick Jefferson, VP of Global Enablement at Netskope and author of Sales Enablement 3.0, joins Ashleigh and Ryan to discuss networking, leadership, and being an ally on the corporate and individual level.

Sales Enablement

-Roderick started his career as a BDR and quickly got promoted to an AE. But, he realized he loved the process of selling, not the quota that hung over his head. So, he moved into sales training.

Networking

-Networking is about the other person. It has nothing to do with telling them about yourself or pushing your product, service, or solution.

-Stop selling and start helping. You want to find mutually equitable relationships.

Old Tactics

-The old sales tactics (think Glengarry Glenross) persist because old school salespeople refuse to mature their strategy.

-Embrace that the world changed and selling has never been more personal.

Video

-Many salespeople fear utilizing video because they can’t sell their product or platform. What they’re selling those videos is their personality.

-It takes time to become comfortable. However, once you do become comfortable, it’s a powerful tool.

Sharing

-You’re invaluable because of what you share. Sharing is how you build your trust, credibility, and brand. But, you can’t expect anything in return.

Leaders vs. Managers

-If your markers of success are awards and numbers, you’re a manager. True leaders don’t care about awards. They care about their people.

New BDRs and SDRs

-Use a guided learning path with new BDRs and SDRs. They had a syllabus and plan for each semester and year. Use that to your advantage instead of trying to retrain them.

-Don’t expect them to know everything. Expect them to be positive and open to learning new things.

Being an Ally - Corporate

-Think about the diversity of your hiring managers, the impression your website is making, inclusive mentorships, anti-racism education, community collaboration, marketing practices, entrepreneurial investments, among many other things.

Being an Ally - Individual

-Think about owning your biases, speaking up against racism, holding your elected officials responsible, advocating for change with actions, financially supporting organizations that create change, voting, and preparing the next generation to carry the torch.

Resources

SDR Manager at Gong.io and Co-Founder of the Women in Sales Club, Gabrielle Blackwell, joins Ashleigh and Ryan to talk about building relationships as an SDR and managing your team of SDRs.

SHOW NOTES

Getting to know Gabi (and Ashleigh and Ryan)

- Lou Malnati's is the best deep-dish pizza. Period.

- Different experiences with different sibling order! Chuck E. Cheese = no. Matching outfits = no? Coordinating outfits = yes.

- Embrace kids’ interests to get them to gravitate to what you like. Don't force it, let them come to you!

Sales Styles

- If you're struggling in sales - maybe you're in the wrong type of sale!

- Try different products, cycles, styles and eventually you'll find a fit and it's magical.

Resilience in sales

- Everyone will struggle with different aspects of sales

- Sales professionals need to be able to speak up, share their experiences (ie call out microagressions)

- Gabrielle is proof - you can come through incredibly toxic situations and call out illegal behavior, your career IS NOT OVER.

- "When do I get to stop 'bouncing back?". Fatigue is real and the effects are lasting

- Receptive leadership makes a significant difference.

- Leadership must be a partner in the process, not "tell me what you want" which puts the burden on the under-represented and leads to unhealthy dynamics.

Selling on Linkedin

- Don't have an alternate agenda - make intentions clear to build trust.

- SDRs get distracted by desired outcome and fail to demonstrate GENUINE CURIOSITY.

- You become interesting, by being interested.

- Do some research, allow the other person to correct if needed.

-Think long term - even if there isn't a meeting or deal right now your curiosity can build pipe for next quarter!

Pipeline management

- Consistency is key. Monthly numbers are hard because it incentivizes shorter-term thinking

- Ashleigh: 3rd week of the month is most stressful because that's when month is won/lost. Week 4 is all about setting up next month so you can start with 20-30% of your number on the books.

- Plan for the worst, hope for best - be conservative!

- You own your numbers - not your leadership.

Different kinds of performers

- High activity - Lower conversion. Tons of data, cannot be allowed to be "activity for activity's sake"

- Lower activity - high conversion. Typically more senior...hard to spot trends because of lower volume.

- Both are valid - both need to be managed differently.

Resources

SDR Manager at Gong.io and Co-Founder of the Women in Sales Club, Gabrielle Blackwell, joins Ashleigh and Ryan to talk about building relationships as an SDR and managing your team of SDRs.

SHOW NOTES

Getting to know Gabi (and Ashleigh and Ryan)

- Lou Malnati's is the best deep-dish pizza. Period.

- Different experiences with different sibling order! Chuck E. Cheese = no. Matching outfits = no? Coordinating outfits = yes.

- Embrace kids’ interests to get them to gravitate to what you like. Don't force it, let them come to you!

Sales Styles

- If you're struggling in sales - maybe you're in the wrong type of sale!

- Try different products, cycles, styles and eventually you'll find a fit and it's magical.

Resilience in sales

- Everyone will struggle with different aspects of sales

- Sales professionals need to be able to speak up, share their experiences (ie call out microagressions)

- Gabrielle is proof - you can come through incredibly toxic situations and call out illegal behavior, your career IS NOT OVER.

- "When do I get to stop 'bouncing back?". Fatigue is real and the effects are lasting

- Receptive leadership makes a significant difference.

- Leadership must be a partner in the process, not "tell me what you want" which puts the burden on the under-represented and leads to unhealthy dynamics.

Selling on Linkedin

- Don't have an alternate agenda - make intentions clear to build trust.

- SDRs get distracted by desired outcome and fail to demonstrate GENUINE CURIOSITY.

- You become interesting, by being interested.

- Do some research, allow the other person to correct if needed.

-Think long term - even if there isn't a meeting or deal right now your curiosity can build pipe for next quarter!

Pipeline management

- Consistency is key. Monthly numbers are hard because it incentivizes shorter-term thinking

- Ashleigh: 3rd week of the month is most stressful because that's when month is won/lost. Week 4 is all about setting up next month so you can start with 20-30% of your number on the books.

- Plan for the worst, hope for best - be conservative!

- You own your numbers - not your leadership.

Different kinds of performers

- High activity - Lower conversion. Tons of data, cannot be allowed to be "activity for activity's sake"

- Lower activity - high conversion. Typically more senior...hard to spot trends because of lower volume.

- Both are valid - both need to be managed differently.

Resources

Ashleigh and Ryan welcome Ryann Dowdy, sales expert and Co-Founder of Social Sellers Academy, to discuss everything from pre-judging prospects to being a parent in sales.

Her Sales Journey

-Ryann, like many others, landed in sales by accident. Her first job after graduating from college was in radio advertising.

-From there, she moved to the digital marketing space and eventually became the Sales Director of a digital marketing startup based in Kansas City.

-However, about four months into this role, she realized it wasn’t what she wanted. But she had no idea what her next opportunity would be.

-It wasn’t until she started networking that she learned about entrepreneurship and made the switch to teaching sales to female entrepreneurs before founding Social Sellers Academy.

Doors Sales Opened

-Sales opened many doors professionally, monetarily, and personally for Ryann. Not only did she have the opportunity to travel, but she became comfortable speaking about money and taking control over how much she makes. As well as enjoys making conversation with strangers.

Pre-Judging Prospects and Discounts

-One of the blocks Ryann had to work through is pre-judging prospects and prices they’re willing to pay based on certain biases.

-Many businesses undercut their value by believing the customer is always searching for the cheapest option. Discounts are not a necessity.

Training Someone Else

-A lot of business owners feel that nobody can sell the way they can. And, it’s true. A new salesperson will not be as good in the beginning.

-The goal is to play the long game. Invest the time to hire and train someone now because it’ll help to grow your future business.

Parenting and Sales

-There are many benefits to entering sales as a parent. As long as you perform, sales creates a lot of flexibility time-wise for parents. And there is ample opportunity for rapid growth. Sales allows you to make more money at a faster rate than most industries.

Finding the Right Product

-Sometimes it’s not how you’re selling, but what you’re selling. Finding a product that you’re passionate about is the most important building block to a successful sales career.

Connect With Ryann

A leading expert on sales performance, Joe Paranteau, joins Ashleigh and Ryan to talk about his cultural identity and time in the military and how both have helped throughout his journey in sales.

His Sales Journey

-Joe grew up without much, and one of his first memories is selling rocks as paperweights door-to-door.

-Throughout high school and college, he found himself in various sales roles. And, after college, he decided to make it his career.

Terminology

-Although the use of the terms Native American or American Indian is frequent, Indigenous is a term that works well globally, so Joe recommends it most often.

Cultural Identity and Sales

-People don’t look at Joe and see his cultural roots. They look at him and instantly think he’s white and suburban. It wasn’t until the last ten years that he felt comfortable enough to share his heritage in the workplace.

-But, there are many aspects of his culture that helped in his various sales roles. One of the most prominent examples is the circular reference to time in most indigenous cultures. So, he never thought of the sales process as linear and was able to build stronger relationships. He never stopped selling.

Building Rapport

-Although quotas can be intimidating and anxiety-inducing, it’s best not to focus on them. Shifting your focus instead to the customer and the problem you’re solving will help you build stronger relationships and hit your quota.

Tenacity

-Tenacity is something Joe learned early on. Because he comes from a poor background, opportunity wasn’t abundant, and he had to make it for himself.

-If people doubt you, use it as motivation to propel you forward.

Being a Veteran

-Many commercial companies don’t understand veterans and the skills that are gained through serving.

-The military starts everyone from the same place, assuming nobody is confident nor competent. Corporate America could take this note. It spends too much time assuming people know things or are capable of things because of points on a resume.

-Not to mention, veterans are reliable in high-stress situations and culturally aware.

Resources

Show Notes

Stance on Sleep

While Ollie has difficulty sleeping and sees it as a chore because he works with people in different time zones, Ryan sees sleep as an investment.

Why Ryan Invests in Sleep

-With a great night’s sleep, Ryan feels physically and mentally healthier. His back doesn’t ache and his memory recall is improved, among many other things.

Snoring

-While Ryan used to be a snorer, there are a few changes he made that have helped: consistent exercise, losing weight, and sleeping with his head slightly raised.

Winding Down

-Try to respect the time you need to wind down and not reach for electronics. Blue light affects the quality of your sleep.

Waking Up

-It’s equally as important to think about how you wake up because that can have a profound impact on your day.

Connect With Ollie

Ashleigh and Kasey talk with Kris Holmes, Founder of Reframing Joy and Opportunity Creator at Proof Point Marketing, about alternative pronouns, being a parent, and how to support non-binary folx.

Their Sales Journey

-After a difficult divorce left them as a single parent, they began to work in construction part-time to support their family.

-Connections in construction led them to sales. They’ve now been in sales for 5 years.

Being a Parent

-Kris had to quickly learn who they were outside of a long, toxic relationship and how to be a parent at the same time.

-But, as they developed their parenting skills, they became more confident overall. And, they brought that newfound confidence to their sales career.

Pronouns

-Throughout their journey, they’ve grown more comfortable presenting themselves however they wish.

-Their first girlfriend introduced Kris to the world of non-traditional pronouns, and they began to identify as non-binary (they/them).

-They’ve found small ways to integrate this identity into the workplace. One instance is changing their name on Zoom to include their pronouns. And, if they ever are misgendered in a safe working relationship, they will correct the person.

Supporting Non-Binary Folx

-Part of supporting is practicing owning a mistake. It’s okay, and it will happen. Lean into the awkward conversations.

Being Your Full Self

-They waited a long time to feel comfortable being fully themselves, and they’d like to see people do that sooner. First, by parents raising their children to be confident in who they are. Second, by others not being assholes and treating people like human beings.

-You don’t have to understand a decision to respect someone.

Allies

-It’s essential to find an ally in your organization. You can leverage them to help you find a safe working environment.

-Finding allies is about the micro-moments that compound to build trust.

Resources

SHOW NOTES

How Did He Start?

-One moment that stands out is February of 2020 when he attended a conference. One of the speakers was Sara Blakely, Founder of Spanx.

Senior BDR at Reprise and Social Selling Coach at SDR Nation, Evan Patterson, talks to Ashleigh and Sue about his journey into sales, how to socially sell, and why you should incorporate it in your strategy.

His Sales Journey

-Evan’s first job was in high school as a freelance content writer for businesses operating within Second Life.

-However, he needed a more steady income to supplement the writing. So, he started working in a restaurant. While here, someone approached him about a job selling furniture, which he accepted.

-One of his regular retail customers noticed that this job wasn’t fulfilling him. She worked as an insurance agent and offered to help him get involved in that world.

-He worked in insurance for a couple of years before taking everything he learned in B2C and moving to the B2B sales world.

Social Selling Strategy

-Understanding that people like to talk about themselves, he tries to find a way for them to do so through which he can bring in Reprise. And, he approaches them in the way a friend or family member would.

-He also has to make this strategy scalable. So, he looks at the people his ICP follows and admires. Diving into each of their posts’ comments and reactions, he creates campaigns tailored to each post and talks to people he feels he can help.

How He Got Started

-In his first professional sales role after retail, he was given a phonebook, bottle of vodka, red solo cup, and box of tissues. He stayed for a couple of weeks but realized this pace of selling was too slow.

-He explored other options like email marketing but wanted to step it up further. Thinking about how he could do so, he thought about building himself something like a fanbase, creating his referral program and Facebook pages, and sponsoring local events.

-When he made the switch to B2B sales, he thought this same mentality might work.

Is Social Selling Necessary?

-There’s more than one way to get a job done. Social selling is not a necessity, but if you can and want to, you should.

-There are also other factors at play as to whether it would be a good idea to try. The ICP you have and the nature of your product also tie in.

Making Social Selling a Part of Your Strategy

-If your company has a process in place, try to integrate social selling with it and track the meetings it brings in.

-Start with finding the brands and people your ICP loves. Look at the posts they’re interacting with, and tie that in with how your product can solve a problem they face.

Resources

Ashleigh and Francisco dive into how having an attitude of gratitude impacts your life, transforming your relationships with the people around you for the better.

Gratitude’s Impact on the Brain / 00:01:55

-Expressing gratitude activates the ventral and dorsal medial prefrontal cortex. The part of the brain that produces dopamine, serotonin, and oxytocin - or the “happy hormones.”

-One thing to note: expressing gratitude consistently is the only way to see real benefits.

Changing Patterns / 00:04:10

-In an experiment, participants counted the people wearing blue suits in a video. A third of the test group focused so much on counting that they missed the person in a gorilla suit.

-When the brain focuses on negatives, objections, or blockers, it misses opportunities to expand and move forward. Practicing gratitude changes how the brain recognizes patterns, forming a more positive and optimistic outlook.

Francisco’s Positivity / 00:07:05

-Francisco was born with a physical disability, so he’s in a wheelchair. He remembers how difficult his first semester was as he transitioned from Puerto Rico to Rhode Island.

-However, at Thanksgiving that semester, he reflected on the amazing friends he’d made that made him feel that he could be himself. And, he thought about how he could best express his gratitude, writing each a note.

-It became a habit during each major holiday to write a note of gratitude to the people in his life. And, at work, he sets aside an hour each week to write to the team members that helped him.

Francisco’s Guide to a Gratitude Note / 00:12:46

-First and foremost, make it personal. Don’t send the same note to everyone.

-Talk about a moment you shared, whether it was big or small, and how it impacted you. Be specific.

-And, find a way to make that person feel like a hero.

Homework Assignment / 00:21:18

-Share something, either personally or publicly, to express gratitude to someone.

Resources

Francisco Oller Garcia, a Customer Advocate at Drift, joins the team as one of our newest co-hosts. He and Ashleigh discuss his physical disability and how his positivity and honesty have propelled his career forward.

His Sales Journey

-He graduated with an MBA in 2018 and went to work in marketing. As a marketer, you need to wear many hats, one of the most important is business development.

-He now works as a Customer Advocate at Drift but realizes every person is in sales no matter what they do.

Getting Connected With OSoS

-Ashleigh and Francisco met through Kasey last year while he was in the process of determining his next career move.

Feeling Like an “Other” In Sales / 00:05:17

-Francisco has felt like an “other” throughout his life because of his physical disability. In a pre-pandemic world, he rolled into conferences and received stares.

-He’s always chosen to use humor, vulnerability, and honesty to address that elephant in the room and make deeper connections.

-In a post-pandemic world, he doesn’t have to reveal he’s in a wheelchair. He chooses to because it’s an integral part of his identity.

What Is He Most Proud Of?

-As a Latino man with a physical disability and not much SaaS or B2B experience, he’s proud he made it into his dream company, Drift.

The First Thing He’ll Do When “Normality” Resumes?

-Francisco’s heading back to Puerto Rico to see his family.

Connect With Francisco

If you’ve been with us for a while, you’ll recognize Sunanda. She was one of our first interviews, and now she’s back as a co-host. Catch up with her as she talks about what she’s been up to since her last interview.

Her Sales Journey

-After deciding to leave NGOs, Sunanda interviewed with a company for a marketing position. She was offered a role in sales instead and accepted. For the last couple of years, she’s been doing sales coaching and enterprise sales.

Feeling Like an “Other” In Sales

-Sunanda remembers attending a large company event and being the only woman, person of color, and openly queer person in the room.

What Is She Most Proud Of?

-She’s proud of the supportive environment she offers, the group of people she surrounds herself with, and the fact that she stayed with it.

The First Thing He’ll Do When “Normality” Resumes?

-Sunanda wants to go to a diner and eat a big greasy breakfast.

Connect With Sunanda

Currently working out of Hyderabad, India, Sue Singh is one of our newest co-hosts with over 15 years of experience in sales. Get to know a little bit more about her sales journey, how she’s felt like an “other” in sales, and what she’s most proud of.

Her Sales Journey

-Sue accidentally fell into sales in 2004 after her father fell sick, and instead of pursuing an MBA, she decided to stay home with him and look for a job. After interviewing for what she thought was a customer service position, she ended up in a sales role.

-With the help of some great managers, she fell in love with sales and has now been in the industry for 15 years, working mainly in the U.S. market from her home in India.

Getting Connected to OSoS

-Ashleigh and Sue were connected through the social media post of a mutual friend.

Feeling Like an “Other” in Sales

-Always. She’s not only a woman but an introvert, and she began her sales career early. When she first started, she was the youngest person on her team.

What Is She Most Proud Of?

-The relationships she’s built throughout her career.

The First Thing She’ll Do When “Normality” Resumes?

-Visit Ashleigh. Catch Sue in the Netherlands, hopefully soon.

Connect With Sue

Ashleigh and Kasey talk to Raul Gutierrez, Inside Sales Account Manager at Dell Boomi, about improving the interview process, finding the right environment, and his future.

SHOW NOTES

His Sales Journey / 00:00:58

-Raul’s sales journey began in college when he co-founded a small cyber-security software solution with friends, and they tasked him with pitching to investors.

-Through doing this, he found out he could be successful in career technology sales and started at New Relic as an SDR before moving to another big tech company and eventually realizing he enjoys being at startups.

DEI Dialogue / 00:05:19

-Raul stresses that people shouldn’t be afraid to have these hard conversations. When we speak openly and respectfully about what makes us uncomfortable or nervous, it not only makes it easier to discuss but brings us together.

Company Culture and Interviewing / 00:09:23

-Almost all companies, small or large, will sell you a vision during the interview process that seldom is accurate, and you won’t know what it’s actually like until starting.

-Raul would rather companies be honest from the beginning about the shortcomings of their company and the ugly parts of the job at hand. It would make it easier in the long run for both parties to decide if they’re the right fit for each other.

Gauging the Work Environment / 00:13:53

-Ask about the challenges this role will face and what skills or characteristics are necessary to succeed in the position.

-It’s also okay to reach out and ask someone in the company that’s not part of the interview process questions about the culture.

The Right Environment / 00:23:21

-It’s imperative to be introspective and understand what the situation is, how you’re interpreting it, and how it’s making you feel.

-Making a list of the pros and cons of your previous job as well as the job you want can be helpful.

-Remember that you have choices. Your decisions and goals are what form your obligations. You can always make a change if you’re not happy.

His Future / 00:30:48

-He has two overarching goals. The first is to share the knowledge he gains to help others achieve. The other is to seek fulfillment in himself through setting up weekly professional and personal goals.

His Best Advice / 00:33:18

-Just start. It can be poor quality or half-assed; it doesn’t matter. Whatever it is, start.

Resources

Ashleigh and Kasey are back from hiatus to talk about updates to the podcast and what you can expect moving forward.

SHOW NOTES

The Major Updates / 00:00:20

-Ashleigh moved to Europe!

-Now that Kasey’s transitioned her focus to coaching entrepreneurs and business leaders rather than sales, she feels she’s not the best fit for The Other Side of Sales, so she’s stepping back.

-After experiencing 2020, the goal and vision for this podcast broadened immensely. There’s more to do in diversity, equity, and inclusion.

What’s Next / 00:08:43

-New episodes will be released every week on Thursdays.

-New co-hosts, each bringing a unique perspective, will join Ashleigh and will be announced in the coming weeks. And, we’re looking to bring on more!

-The State of Sales Survey will happen again in the fall.

-The “Selling While…” webinar series will continue in the summer.

-Be on the lookout for collaborative content with brands that share our values and mission.

The Take-Away / 00:14:37

-When you care deeply about something, being willing to pause is sometimes one of the best things you can do to move forward.

Let’s Connect!

Moderator Michael Tuso is joined by panelists Rachel Biers, Sunanda Nair, and Tim O’Keeffe to discuss how to bring your full self to work, address uncomfortable situations, and come out to your coworkers.

Connect

With the United States election coming up in less than a week, we would like to endorse the candidate we believe aligns with our mission and encourage everyone, whether you agree or disagree with this endorsement, to VOTE.

SHOW NOTES

Who

-Our mission has always been to create a sales culture where everyone can thrive. In this election, there is one candidate who aligns with this mission and one who actively works against it. We are asking you to vote for Joe Biden for President.

Why

-Democracy is at stake in this election. The soul of our country is at stake in this election. Our current President has repeatedly spread misinformation, sown distrust of the voting process, undermined science, and perpetuated the “us vs. them” narrative.

-We will always have differences in how we believe our country should change, but if we don’t have a shared understanding of what is real and what isn’t, there’s no hope for us to come together and improve.

-We like that Joe Biden addresses reality. He listens to science, is willing to talk about systemic racism, and makes it clear he will be a President that serves everybody - even those that don’t vote for him.

Lastly

-Make a plan, be safe, and, whether you agree or disagree with us, exercise your right to vote.

Resources

Moderator Nikki Ivey talks to panelists Blake Hudson, Chantel George, and Galem Girmay about what it’s like to be a Black sales professional today, including topics like white supremacy in sales, half-hearted change in companies, and how to vet organizations.

Connect with our Guests

Sales Journey

-To say Reuben was reluctant to join sales is an understatement, but with a background in software development and pricing, he started a consulting business and had to begin selling.

-He tried to copy the enterprise salespeople he’d seen at previous companies but felt out of place until he realized selling his way was an option.

-It took a change of mindset to feel comfortable in his sales role; he wasn’t selling or manipulating, but rather helping. This vocabulary switch made everything more natural.

Leaning into Science

-As a software developer, he was brought onto sales calls to answer the deep technical questions the clients had, but that the salesperson wasn’t capable of explaining.

-When he leaned into his technical expertise, rather than trying to be what he thought a salesperson was, he had better interactions with prospects.

Aligning Interests

-All companies tinker with the question of how to align what salespeople say their company can offer versus what the company can provide. A lot of this boils down to incentives.

-If sales reps are purely trying to close deals to get a check and move on, it’s going to work a lot differently than closing deals and receiving compensation as the customer grows more successful over time.

-With his background, he has a unique perspective. He can think about what the customer needs from a sales, technology, and service standpoint.

Acceptance

-Traveling consulting was his primary business until he had children. Missing their big moments was never an option, so he began virtual and local consulting. He might not get a penthouse in New York, but that wasn’t important being present for his kids was.

-This shift allowed him the flexibility he needed to take care of his family and forced him to be more open about his personal life at work.

-Accepting where you are and who you are is powerful. Finding your niche and being the master of your domain brings confidence and security.

His Podcast

-Reuben was having a hard time keeping up with his workload and didn’t have time to meet for informational interviews, so he thought about writing a book or starting a podcast.

-The book is still in the works, but the podcast is up and running, and he interviews sales and marketing experts so that you don’t have to make the same mistakes he did.

Resources

In response to the passing of Ruth Bader Ginsburg, Ashleigh and Kasey take this week to highlight a couple more of the most influential heroes in their lives.

SHOW NOTES

Ruth Bader Ginsburg

-On September 18th, Supreme Court Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg passed away. She was dedicated, eloquent, determined, and honest, among many other things. She leaves a legacy inspirational to so many people, including Ashleigh and Kasey.

Kasey’s Heroes

-Maya Angelou: A guiding quote for Kasey is Angelou’s, “I've learned that people will forget what you said, people will forget what you did, but people will never forget how you made them feel.”

-Mr. Rogers: He celebrated each individual, stating, “As human beings, our job in life is to help people realize how rare and valuable each one of us really is, that each of us has something that no one else has- or ever will have- something inside that is unique to all time. It's our job to encourage each other to discover that uniqueness and to provide ways of developing its expression.” What makes each person unique is what makes them powerful, and if we could recognize this, we’d all be a lot better.

Ashleigh’s Heroes

-John McCain: Ashleigh was lucky enough to meet him during a campaign stop when she was a kid and, as she grew older, watched him grow into a political force. In addition to his service story, he had an unparalleled ability to build compromise and consensus.

-Marie Curie: She devoted her life to science and, though she didn’t know what the outcome of her research would be, persisted with the help of her support system that championed her the whole way through.

Why Have Heroes?

-Not only can you learn from watching them, but they can also instill a sense of hope. Heroes remind us that there’s a light at the end of the tunnel.

Resources

Ashleigh and Kasey talk to the Founder of Factor8 and Girls Club, Lauren Bailey, otherwise known as LB, about salary negotiations, justification, and perfectionism.

#GirlsClub

-Lauren spent 15 years in the inside sales industry, and as she grew, found she was one of the only women at the table. However, it wasn’t until she started Factor8 and joined the Women Sales Pros group that she realized the power of female mentorship.

-#GirlsClub helps women who want to get to the next level in their sales career achieve that goal by providing skill training, confidence boost, and a supportive community.

Encouragement

-A confidence gap exists between men and women, from promotions to salary negotiations, women are sure that if they work hard, they will get the promotion or the raise, but this isn’t the case.

-As a leader, you have a financial responsibility to your company, but women need the encouragement to negotiate. Teach them the skills to do that, and it will pay off, you won’t lose them.

-As a woman, start advocating for yourself, and don’t be afraid to raise your hand if you want or need something.

Justification

-Finding a mentor seems like a daunting task, but you don’t need a great reason to ask someone you admire a question or to send a connection request.

-Lauren coaches women to get past this thinking by offering a community that encourages risk-taking. Women find their voices in a supportive environment and automatically connect with a mentor.

Perfectionism

-The most important thing to remember is that everybody makes mistakes, even the people you admire. It’s okay to screw up.

-Move past the shame of a mistake by being vulnerable. Speak about it and watch others do the same.

-This is a moment that’s highly intense for everyone. You might not want to speak about how you feel for fear of saying the wrong thing, but as long as you’re earnest and open to learning, it’s okay to mess it up. It’s a part of the process.

Connect with Girls Club

Kasey went through a very traumatic event in early June and recently returned to the podcast. Today she shares what happened and offers guidance on how to best support survivors of traumatic experiences.

The Attack

-Kasey had two dogs, Mae, who she lovingly refers to as her “ride or die bitch,” and Pillsbury, who had a troubled upbringing and had shown aggression towards Mae, but had never been aggressive to Kasey or her boyfriend, Andy.

-One afternoon while Andy was gone, Kasey heard Mae barking. Knowing Pillsbury was about to attack, she grabbed Mae to bring her outside as he charged, biting Kasey’s arms, chest, face, and ear.

-She managed to get the door open and scream for help. One of her neighbors ran to the end of the driveway, saw what was happening, grabbed her husband, and called 911.

-Paramedics and firefighters arrived but refused to come and get her because of the proximity of the dog. Kasey mustered all of her strength to get up and walk to the end of the driveway where she passed out.

The Hospital

-She spent the next several hours in the emergency room, having doctors take x-rays of her wounds.

-Her orthopedic surgeon was familiar with the genetic degenerative neurological disease that affects her extremities and alters her pain tolerance. Because of this knowledge, he recognized she was strong enough for him to clean and close her wounds right then to make her more comfortable throughout the night.

-The surgery went smoothly, but she felt physically and emotionally drained. Though she wanted to shut down and hide, she knew that she needed to communicate, so she texted Ashleigh and a few close friends as well as posted on LinkedIn.

Recovery

-Being triggered is no joke for those recovering from a traumatic experience. It comes out of nowhere, puts you right back in the traumatic moment, and leaves you feeling disempowered and out of control.

-While it’s helpful to not go through this experience alone, one of the hardest parts is that the trauma isn’t her own, she shares it with other people who have been affected by it in very different ways.

How to Support

-Don’t ask questions that force someone to relive their experience. Don’t ask questions that minimize their experience. Don’t act as if nothing has happened.

-The details that a person chooses to tell about an experience are a gift, but not the full story. You don’t have permission to ask for more or make assumptions.

Surviving

-Kasey’s consistent work with a therapist throughout the years before the attack helped her to navigate her emotions more adeptly afterward.

-Form a strong sense of self and support system before anything happens, so that you’re prepared if something occurs.

Resources

Ashleigh and Kasey flip the script on temporary co-host Brian Smith Jr. this week, asking him about his future in sales, sharing failure, and finding motivation.

Being a Cohost

-Brian’s biggest takeaway while filling in for Kasey as a cohost was that everybody has a story that can help move the sales industry forward, but no one is taking the time to listen. Listening to the unheard voices will help to build better organizations.

Staying in Sales

-Most salespeople struggle with the decision to stay in sales or move on. Sales is a hard industry filled with rejection and many ups and downs, a lot of it out of your control.

-Brian’s unafraid of hard work, and he’s proven that throughout his career, but this has intimidated a lot of people.

-He’s reflected enough to understand that he has the discipline for sales. It’s not his work ethic. He’s dealing with a lot of people that aren’t upfront about their discrimination.

Connection

-Reach out to the people that you admire and follow up if they don’t respond. Throw the rules out the window because they’re only optional. Make moves based on your instinct and experience.

Sharing Failures

-Salespeople only talk about the wins, brushing failures under the rug, and quickly moving on because they think it might cost them their job or a promotion. A lot of positives come from discussing failure.

-Sharing failure allows you to understand where you went wrong and prevent others from making the same mistake.

Motivation

-The quota isn’t a motivator. Dig deeper into your motivation by asking yourself why five times. It’s important to have a personal connection with the work that you do.

-Do the work yourself, don’t wait for your manager to do his with you. The people that understand what they need and bring this information to their managers end up getting way more support.

-We’re told that if you put your head down and work hard, someone will notice and give you a promotion. It rarely works this way. You have to carve a path for yourself.

Perception

-Brian was an outgoing kid, always the loudest in the room. As he grew older, that shifted, and he became much more reserved, feeling he needed to tone himself down.

-He’s been able to use this shift to his advantage. It’s powerful to be able to listen, but he does feel that people haven’t been able to see the real him because he was afraid of how they would perceive him.

Resources

Ashleigh and Brian talk to Travis King, host of The Community Builder Show, and advocate for human connection. Travis has worked with Fortune 500 brands, venture-backed technology startups, and rising entrepreneurs. This week they discuss downplaying insight, connecting with the Black community, and strategically jumping from job to job.

Power of Human Connection

-The professional world mimics school. Often, you see someone or scroll past their content every day on LinkedIn, but never stop to connect or communicate with them.

-Forming new connections seems like work, and there are so many other things that need your attention, but it’s an important part of sales.

-You don’t have to do much. It can be as small as taking a few more seconds to write a full comment rather than leave an emoji.

Downplaying Insight

-Travis tried to bring his talented friend, Brandon, onto his sales team. Travis went to his manager after the interview to ask how it had gone and was told that Brandon was too cocky.

-This story resonated with Brian, who tends to downplay his insight. If he comes into a room confident and knowledgeable, he’s often treated as a threat.

-No one should feel the need to downplay their insight. Just because you know something does not mean someone else does. It’s a disservice to the entire team to not share your knowledge.

Black Sales Professionals

-Representation does matter. If people don’t see others that look like them in sales roles, they don’t know that it’s a possibility.

-Companies need to start targeting the many talented Black salespeople working in retail stores or fast-food chains. Most aren’t aware that sales is a viable career and that they’ve already acquired many of the necessary skills through their current job.

How to Resonate with the Black Community

-Travis advocates for completely stripping the fluff of the job description. According to him, companies should say, “We need hungry, curious, coachable people who are looking to grow. What will you be doing? Setting up meetings with decision-makers to potentially purchase this technology.”

-The sales world needs to figure out how to communicate with underrepresented communities, not force those groups to communicate in the same way they do.

Acquiring Information

-Little strategic career steps that may not make sense to the outside world will help in the long run.

-Play the game. Acquire all the information you can, take what you need, and use it for what you want. Information will empower and enable you.

Resources

HR Background

-Tara always saw herself in sales but fell into HR while working as a leasing consultant. After receiving little training before starting the position, she documented her learning process and used that knowledge to help all incoming employees.

Influences

-Tara grew up in Orange County with her adoptive parents, an interracial couple. Both experiencing hate herself and seeing the hate her parents received strongly influenced who she is personally and professionally.

-She has five biological and two adopted children and a passion for changing the workforce so that they never have to fight the same battles that she or her parents have.

The Right Environment

-It’s tough to immediately know if a company’s culture is right for you, so do some digging. Figure out if they have publicly spoken about the issues most important to you.

-Look beyond their words and into their actions. If they’re not actively giving opportunities to underrepresented groups, that’s a major red flag.

-Don’t be afraid to ask about their stance on these tough subjects. Asking lets them know that you’re passionate.

HR’s Role

-HR’s current role is to protect the company, not the employees, and this needs to change.

-The organization’s general counsel or employment attorney should protect the company, and HR should focus on ensuring employees are protected.

Filing a Complaint

-Problems won’t be fixed unless you work to solve them, speak up if you feel uncomfortable or see mistreatment.

-Document every instance in a notebook. Include the following information: date, time, place, people involved, and what was specifically said or done. Doing this provides evidence of a pattern should the situation escalate.

-You will not be blacklisted from any industry for filing a complaint.

Paperwork

-If you are terminated, never sign anything immediately. Take it home and have someone look through the paperwork.

Connect with Tara

Show Notes

Hair

-Reland grew up in a fairly affluent White neighborhood constantly asked if her hair could be touched. She didn’t truly understand the negative nuances of that question or action until later on.

Being Mixed

-It’s fair to say she’s privileged as a mixed-race person. Most people assume she’s White, but that doesn’t mean she’s a stranger to racism.

-Reland is tired of frequently receiving questions concerning her ethnicity. They make her feel boxed in, and once she’s been labeled as a Black person, her status changes.

Positivity

-Experiencing racism in any form is incredibly taxing, but Reland is naturally positive, resilient, and energetic. Her motto is that when one door closes, another opens, and she’s not going to sit and stare at a closed door.

Her Sales Journey

-She began in retail then worked at a bank for a period before returning to retail as a Regional Merchandising Manager for Michael Kors. She left Michael Kors after being recruited to do business development for staffing.

The Health Toll

-To express an opinion as a Black woman makes you angry, but constantly being everyone’s cheerleader takes a physical and emotional toll.

-Reland ended up in the hospital for four days because her kidneys were on the verge of failure and she hadn’t paid attention to the signs. She’s held to a higher standard and feels she needs to show up for work no matter what.

Starting a Business

-After losing her job due to COVID and unable to get ahold of unemployment benefits, she started her own business in late March.

-As she built it, the push to amplify Black voices began, so her launch has been successful.

-Register to vote and vote with your dollar. Support the Black-owned businesses in your community.

Performative Ally-ship

-You won’t get a gold star for posting on Instagram. Your actions speak louder than words or posts.

Resources