Stacking Growth | The B2B Go-to-Market Podcast

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Sidney Waterfall, SVP of Go-To-Market Strategy at Passetto, joins Steph Crugnola to talk about Attribution and Funnel Tracking.

In this episode, Sidney goes into Self Reported Attribution - why it's valuable and how it can be utilized most effectively. See the video on our ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠YouTube Channel⁠

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Refine Labs’ next Expert Session, featuring Chris Walker and Crissy and Charlie Saunders of CS2 Marketing, will be Wednesday April 24 at 12pm central. ⁠Register here⁠. 

See the full video and more on our YouTube channel

Stay on top of all Refine Labs news and events by subscribing to our newsletter.

Refine Labs’ next Expert Session, featuring Chris Walker and Crissy and Charlie Saunders of CS2 Marketing, will be Wednesday April 24 at 12pm central. Register here. 

Check out our new partnership with Aspireship

Sidney Waterfall, SVP of Go-To-Market Strategy at Passetto, joins Steph Crugnola to talk about Attribution and Funnel Tracking.

In this episode, Sidney covers the foundations of Attribution in a Demand Generation strategy, how the evolution of buyer behavior has affected the way we monitor attribution, and the mindset shift you need to make to set yourself up for success. See the video on our ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠YouTube Channel⁠

See the video on our YouTube channel
Refine Labs’ next Expert Session, featuring Chris Walker and Crissy and Charlie Saunders of CS2 Marketing, will be Wednesday April 24 at 12pm central. Register here.

In this episode, Ashley tackles one of the hardest parts in the journey towards a Demand Gen strategy: convincing leadership to make the change. She talks about the breadcrumbs you should leave, the pitch you should put together, and the data you should collect. See the video on our ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠YouTube Channel⁠

In this episode, Ashley walks us through the Leading Indicators to measure when you're building a Demand Gen Dashboard. She encourages paying attention to qualitative insights like website traffic on high intent pages, tracking repeat engagement on content, and reinforcing marketing fundamentals to measure success. See the video on our ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠YouTube Channel⁠

In this episode, Ashley walks us through the metrics needed to create an efficient and comprehensive Demand Gen Dashboard. She gives an overview of the monthly and quarterly metrics to keep an eye on, and how to keep all of that information organized. See the video on our ⁠⁠⁠⁠YouTube Channel⁠

In this episode, Ashley talks through the philosophical standpoint of zooming out to look at Demand Gen as a holistic business outcome vs a highly segmented channel specific outcome. She also covers the differences between a traditional lead gen reporting and Refine Lab's unique approach See the video on our ⁠⁠⁠YouTube Channel⁠

See the video on our ⁠⁠YouTube Channel⁠

See the video on our YouTube Channel

See the video on our ⁠YouTube channel

See the video on our YouTube channel

Sidney Waterfall hosts today, joined by Sydney Sloan, CMO of Drata, to talk about timing in your career - how to know the right time to step away and finding the next right opportunity. She discusses her own experience of taking time off to recharge and reflect before starting her new role at Drata. Sydney also talks about her favorite stage of growth and the importance of finding a company with a strong product-market fit. She emphasizes the need for balance in life and the value of building relationships and connections. Sydney shares her approach to measuring the impact of marketing and the importance of focusing on revenue and efficiency. She also discusses the changing landscape of marketing, including the role of AI and the need for digital sophistication.

Kaylee is back in the host seat today, joined by Lane Scott Jones, Head of Content at Zapier to follow her journey from agency to in-house content marketing roles. She discusses the importance of understanding the mechanics behind the business and mapping content to business goals. Lane also talks about the challenges she faced in transitioning from an agency to an in-house role and how she navigated those waters. She emphasizes the need for content to be seen as a strategic function and the importance of collaboration between content and other marketing teams. Lane also shares insights into Zapier's content team structure and the impact of content on the company's ROI.

Link to the Corporate Jargon Translator

Cassidy and Carl are joined by Nate Nasralla, co-founder of Fluint, to discuss the shift in the sales process and the need for a new approach to sales enablement. He explains that in the new world of sales, buyers are already well-educated and are looking for help in building the case for change within their organization. Nate emphasizes the importance of creating account-based content that resonates with the buyer's language and context. He also shares insights on the power of narrative-based business cases and the value of concise and clear writing in sales communication.

Cassidy and Carl were joined by Anthony Iannarino to follow him through the development of his innovative sales process. He details the inspiration and first experience with this style of selling, and then how he used it to move his and other careers forward. He stresses the four most important things that this strategy establishes:

• Creating Value Immediately

• Positioning Yourself as an Expert/Authority

• Answering: Why Change

• Making it Easy to Get a Second Meeting

He also suggests that SDRs should be involved in the total sales process to learn the language of the client, making the whole team more effective in communication. Finally, he previews his upcoming book Negativity Fast, and the top lesson everyone can learn from it.

Cassidy and Carl were joined by MJ Smith, CMO @ CoLab, to chat about her transition into a CMO role, giving all of the advice she wishes she would’ve had access to before her move. 

She starts at the very beginning, diving deep into the way she sought out companies to apply for, and how to make sure to achieve alignment in company and culture. Then, she covers the first 90 days in the role to talk about what worked, what didn’t, and what she learned. She also covers best practices for getting your product in front of the right eyes, and how to track and dissect that data. Overall, this deep dive into creating a demand engine from scratch is a must-listen for every marketer, especially if you have a goal to transition into a leadership role on your horizon.

Carl and Cassidy were joined today by Refine Labs’ Stephanie Crugnola, Content Strategist, and Miles Campbell, Video Ops Manager to get you started on your organic content journey!

They start from the beginning and cover tools on how and where to launch your content, the team and tech you’ll need to get started, and where to get content inspiration. They drop tips for writing and recording, and deliver an action plan for effective post-production. Make sure to check out the video on the Refine Labs YouTube channel to see the slides when they’re up!

Kaylee takes the reins today, joined by Robin Daniels to discuss his vast experience and wisdom on evaluating go to market, job opportunities, career growth, mentorship, and leadership. They discuss the importance of tailoring content to the needs of the audience, evaluating job opportunities, and building a successful career. Robin shares his insights on evaluating company culture, finding a mission worth fighting for, and working with great people. He also emphasizes the importance of energy, initiative, and building a chorus of support in order to succeed in your career.

Cassidy is back joining Carl and Lavender’s Will Aitken to unpack how to build an organic growth strategy from scratch. Will discusses the importance of understanding the target audience and creating diverse content across platform, topic, style, and audience goals. He also emphasizes the value of research and learning from successful influencers in the industry and stresses the need for subject matter expertise, highlighting the role it plays in creating effective content. And finally, Cassidy asks what to do about Carl.

Kaylee and Carl were joined by Tyler Lessard, VP Marketing and Chief Video Strategist @ Vidyard to chat all things video marketing. With almost a decade of experience at Vidyard, Tyler has witnessed the incredible evolution of video in the tech and SaaS industries. He shares his insights on staying motivated and navigating the ever-changing landscape.

All three hosts emphasize the immense value of video in sales and marketing, urging professionals to adapt and innovate to stay ahead in the industry. The rise of using video as a tool for authenticity and transparency is also discussed, along with the exciting possibilities for future video use cases.

While Cassidy is away, Carl takes the wheel, joined by Kaylee Edmondson - VP of Revenue R&D at Refine Labs! They go head to head about paid versus organic media - they cover myths, uncover truths, and dig into the ways to leverage each strategy to build the best brand presence. Then they switch gears to customer research, providing 6 insightful questions to ask customers while interviewing.

Cassidy and Carl were joined by Jen Allen-Knuth, Community Growth @ Lavender, to chat about the need to shift mindset as a creator and community leader. She dives into the way Lavender uses LinkedIn as an informal listening mechanism to get into the heads of buyers on a larger scale and steps that revenue professionals can take to start evolving beyond their “why us” messaging to  “why change”. 

Then, she covers the way she works to shift perception about cold emails. She focuses on the larger story around earning customer attention, and encouraging people to embrace the emotional response to what they don’t enjoy. This shift allows for honest and productive conversation as a baseline to find the beliefs and assumptions behind the emotions.

Stay tuned through the end for a challenge and a promise from Carl.

In our premiere video episode, Courtney Vermette, Associate Creative Director at Refine Labs, walks Cassidy and Carl through a teardown of toast’s website, email, and paid social strategies. 

On the website, Courtney assesses the use of video, copy (including the effectiveness, necessity, and consistency of puns), and calls to action across several different pages. Then, she moves to email in order to point out some similar strengths and weaknesses in line with and contrast to the website. Finally, she pulled up three of toast’s paid social ads and the team chatted through different ways to use design elements that could boost engagement and conversion rates.

This walkthrough is an incredible opportunity to ask yourself the same questions and analyze your own materials for the same qualities.

Today Cassidy and Carl are joined by Devin Reed, Head of Content at Clari to chat about transformational leadership in Content Strategy and beyond. Devin spills his secrets on how to make a splash in a new role at a successful organization by leveraging strategic priorities.

He also digs into getting buy-in on an employee LinkedIn posting strategy and how to affect change internally. He walks Cassidy and Carl through the personal monetization, consulting, and gated content strategies he has adopted through his career.

Today’s episode was recorded live, featuring Dan Case, Creative Director at Refine Labs. Dan leads Cassidy and Carl through a Creative Teardown of Dashlane, looking at their design choices across branding, website, and paid social. 

He assesses their prioritization of programs and the differentiation between them that can cause confusion and conflict in message. With questions from Carl, Cassidy, and the audience, Dan explores reasons behind this rift between programs and how companies can achieve clarity.

They also discuss in depth the idea of rebranding: how and why might a company come to the conclusion of needing a rebrand, and how do you go about doing it in the most effective way. 

This walk through is an incredible opportunity to ask yourself the same questions and analyze your own materials for the same qualities. 

Today Cassidy and Carl are joined by Dan Sanchez, Director of Inbound Marketing at Element451 to chat about audience growth, among other podcast and personal brand insight and advice!

He starts by tracing his journey through shifting industry, why he moved into Higher Education, and how to align experience with passion when making a move. He then dives into the importance of vertical systems in SaaS, the impact of vocabulary change from “Marketing” to “Audience Growth”, the biggest problem companies face when trying to grow their reach, and more!

This week’s episode features a keynote speech by Sidney Waterfall, Senior Vice President of Growth at Refine Labs. She presented at the Full Funnel Summit on How to Measure Demand for the Entire Funnel. 

She explains why it’s time for measurement to change, gives an overview of key terms including Dark Social, Pipe Framework, and Hybrid Attribution before presenting actionable steps for setting up your own Framework. Sidney approaches the topic from a philosophical and data-backed perspective, digging into the root cause of measurement issues and how to improve results in a practical and meaningful way.

Cassidy and Carl sat down with Kate Hammitt, CMO of Splash, to chat all things Event Marketing. She covers how the field has grown and evolved over the past couple of years, tracing the history of expectations from in-person trade shows and flagship events into virtual and hybrid events, and the impact they have on marketing strategy. She also discusses how companies like Splash are streamlining the process for companies, what the focus of goals and data should realistically be, and more!

Today’s episode was recorded live, featuring Refine Labs’ VP of Creative: Triana Mills. Triana leads Cassidy and Carl through a Creative Teardown of Recurly, looking at their design choices in three programs: website, email, and paid social. 

She assesses the use, effectiveness, and consistency of color, graphics, messaging, and more, sparking productive discussions on possible reasons behind each choice and suggestions for improvement. This walk through is an incredible opportunity to ask yourself the same questions and analyze your own materials for the same qualities.

Cassidy and Carl got to sit down and chat with Talin Koutnouyan, VP of Strategy & Analytics at Influential, about the past, present, and future of Influencer Marketing. 

She outlines some main differences between strategy in B2C versus B2B, and what each could stand to learn from the other. Finally, she outlines a plan for “Carl’s Friend” who wants to get into Influencer Marketing – what to expect and how to approach brands!

Cassidy and Carl got to sit down and chat with Peter Walker, head of Insights at Carta, about building insights and leveraging them to boost both marketing and sales functions. The cover collaboration with marketing, knowing what insights to look for and which hold the most resonance, surprises Peter has encountered along his journey, and a hint at what’s coming next for the insights strategy at Carta! 

Make sure to listen to the end to hear Peter break down his “Lattice” Approach to an insights framework!

Cassidy and Carl chat today with Grant Duncan (VP of Marketing) and Omar Hamoda (Senior Brand Designer) at Zingtree about the role of AI - in particular, generative AI - and its impact on marketing & sales. They address the decision to jump into AI, individual workflows, different tools and their benefits/drawbacks, implications and ethics, and more.

For reference, here are some of the posts and ads discussed through the episode:

Post that kicked this off - here.

Zingtree Ads - here.

MidJourney - here.

We're kicking things off in Season 3 with a brand deep dive featuring our Chief Growth Officer, Cassidy Shield, and CMO of Zappi, Yvonne O'Brien. Key questions to ask yourself: Do your prospects have an emotional connection to your brand, and how do you build that connection in a space with huge competitors? A few more topics include brand activation, foundation, how to consistently test & learn, and what you can translate from B2C to B2B. Take a listen and make your brand more valuable and distinctive after absorbing this marque episode.

Welcome back! Cassidy, Carl, and the rest of the Refine Labs crew have returned for Season 3 of Stacking Growth. This "State of the Union" episode features Cassidy Shield, Chief Growth Officer, and Carl Ferreira, Director of Sales, setting the table for whats to come this season. Brand, creative, differentiation in B2B, coaching, alignment are just a handful of the topics we'll chop up for this third season. We're excited to be back and hope you are, too!

Cassidy has gone on record stating that marketing-sales alignment is largely a marketing problem. However, let's not drop all the blame on marketing. In this episode, Cassidy and Carl go over 5 ways sales leaders can demonstrate leadership in aligning marketing with sales.

1 - Quality over quantity

If the leads "suck" - it's as much on sales as marketing. Stop insisting on lead volume when the leads don't convert to pipeline and revenue. Instead, empower marketing to focus on high-quality leads.

2 - Encourage building awareness

It's not news to anyone that it's easier to sell when prospects know who you are and what you stand for as a company. The best sellers I know are huge advocates for building awareness and are pushing marketing to be more innovative. 

3 - Invite marketing into the sales process

There is no better place to learn about what works/doesn't work than in the sales process. Explain the sales process and how deals are done. Get your marketing team licenses to your call recording software. Invite product marketing to sales calls. Take time to structure your learnings so they are actionable.

4 - Align outbound sales with inbound marketing

There is a good chance that your outbound sales efforts are fishing in the same pond as your marketing efforts. Therefore, spend time sharing learnings and aligning campaign efforts, so the positioning and messaging are consistent with prospects.

5 - Lead by example & don't let sales off the hook

Leaders don't make excuses. If marketing isn't carrying its weight, get in the game and help. If your sales team isn't following through, take your team to task. When you show that your goal is the company's success and not the success of one organization over another, you are a leader others will respect.  


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Carl Ferreira doesn't waste any time kicking off this conversation with Jenn Davis, Co-Founder and Head of Marketing at Gradient Works. Jenn has been instrumental in designing and building the Dynamic Books category, a new way to handle sales territories. In this episode, Jenn takes Carl and Cassidy through:

- Identifying when/if a new category is needed

- Doing research to get "message-market-fit" prior to building out a product

- Creating a strategic narrative around that new category and building it out

- and much more.

Join Stacking Growth Live every other Wednesday at 1:00 PM ET by Registering here.

Join Stacking Growth Live every other Wednesday at 1:00 PM ET by Registering here.

Join Stacking Growth Live every other Wednesday at 1:00 PM ET by Registering here.

On this episode of Stack Growth, our very own Tory Kindlick  and Victoria Sakal were joined by two of our friends from Centerline Digital (Greg Harbinson, Creative Director & Fabian Marquex, Creative Director), to discuss 5 Trends to Improve Brand Engagement:

• How to Create Authentic Content
• How to Deliver Account-Based Experiences
• Leveraging Third-Party Experts
• How to Drive Better Brand Awareness
• Exploring the Metaverse

Join Stacking Growth Live every other Wednesday at 1:00 PM ET by Registering here.