Skip to main content
The Search For Growth

The Search For Growth

By The Search For Growth

Welcome to The Search For Growth. A podcast for growth-mindset entrepreneurs looking to improve 1% each day. Each week an American and a Brit get together to unpack the biggest topics from the start-up world, interview founders, and share frameworks & principles to help you grow. Chris Gibson is the Founder of Wavelength, a bootstrapped start-up, and Alfie Marsh is the Head of US Go-To-Market at Spendesk, a venture backed unicorn. As an engineer and a sales guy, we have two different perspectives on life. But we are united by one common goal. The Search For Growth.
Where to listen
Amazon Music Logo

Amazon Music

Apple Podcasts Logo

Apple Podcasts

Castbox Logo

Castbox

Google Podcasts Logo

Google Podcasts

Spotify Logo

Spotify

#14 COO @Chargehound, Pallavi Kuppa-Apte | Using YC to Get Customers | Going from Pivot to Acquisition | Marketing Hacks for Conferences
#14 COO @Chargehound, Pallavi Kuppa-Apte | Using YC to Get Customers | Going from Pivot to Acquisition | Marketing Hacks for Conferences
(00:50) Starting at Beacon, a YC-backed crowdfunding journalism company (03:03) Pivoting to Chargehound (09:01) Using tech stack to get the idea for Chargehound, chargeback overview (13:53) Getting first YC customers (17:04) Identifying the correct types of customers (22:10) Identifying which is easier to sell to - customers using alternatives or ones without a solution (27:53) Leveling sales up over time (28:33) Distribution strategy and using puppies as a marketing hack at a conference (36:48) Getting acquired by PayPal - timeline, process (39:29) Getting ideas for new companies (42:20) Hiring insights (44:13) Challenges at Chargehound (45:44) Rapid fire questions - Books and pieces of advice   Pallavi Kuppa-Apte's LinkedIn Chargehound Books Mentioned The Messy Middle Making of a Manager When Breath Becomes Air The Search For Growth Podcast Alfie Marsh B2B Go-To-Market Advisory Alfie Marsh's Newsletter "Rocket GTM" Chris Gibson's Newsletter "Content I Consumed" Alfie's LinkedIn Chris' LinkedIn
52:33
February 03, 2023
#13 The Remembering vs Experiencing Self | How to Use the Peak-End Rule in Demos
#13 The Remembering vs Experiencing Self | How to Use the Peak-End Rule in Demos
(00:00) Remembering vs Experiencing Self - What is it (03:22) Peak-End Rule (05:29) Duration Neglect (14:36) Emotion in Demos (20:14) Why Journaling is Important Books Mentioned Thinking Fast and Slow The Search For Growth Podcast Alfie Marsh B2B Go-To-Market Advisory Alfie Marsh's Newsletter "Rocket GTM" Chris Gibson's Newsletter "Content I Consumed" Alfie's LinkedIn Chris' LinkedIn
22:28
January 27, 2023
#12 Thinking Fast and Slow | Using Cognitive Science in Business | System 1 vs System 2 thinking | Narrow vs Broad Framing
#12 Thinking Fast and Slow | Using Cognitive Science in Business | System 1 vs System 2 thinking | Narrow vs Broad Framing
(00:00) Intro - Daniel Kahneman Thinking Fast and Slow (00:58) Defining System 1 and System 2 (04:22) Cognitive friction (06:23) Pattern matching in sales and hiring (07:36) System 1 as heuristics (08:34) System 2 takes energy (10:05) Narrow vs broad framing (12:19) Narrow framing in life and the availability heuristic (15:24) Framing when making business decisions (19:45) Framing in sales (23:58) B2C as System 1, B2B as System 2 implications (29:56) Interplay between System 1 and System 2 - illusions and traps (31:38) Loss aversion and EV (34:12) The biggest competition in sales is the status quo Books Mentioned Thinking Fast and Slow The Chimp Paradox The Search For Growth Podcast Alfie Marsh B2B Go-To-Market Advisory Alfie Marsh's Newsletter "Rocket GTM" Chris Gibson's Newsletter "Content I Consumed" Alfie's LinkedIn Chris' LinkedIn
38:54
January 20, 2023
#11 Founder & CEO @Lempire, Guillaume Moubeche | How to build a multi-million $ bootstrapped startup
#11 Founder & CEO @Lempire, Guillaume Moubeche | How to build a multi-million $ bootstrapped startup
(00:00) Intro - Founder & CEO @Lempire, Guillaume Moubeche (01:33) Growing up in Paris, first business (3:55) Starting a business with his dad (10:22) Raising $30m as a publicity stunt (15:07) Reasons for bootstrapping (16:53) Quickly profitable, early strong growth (19:36) Using community as a strategy (24:31) Deciding to take VC (29:25) Mission, narratives, and stories (36:35) Financially supporting himself in France while bootstrapping (42:42) How to measure success (45:59) Pressure of last 12 months (51:20) What's next (52:44) Rapid fire questions - books, advice Guillaume Moubeche Twitter Guillaume Moubeche LinkedIn Lemlist YouTube The Search For Growth Podcast Alfie Marsh B2B Go-To-Market Advisory Alfie's Newsletter "Rocket GTM" Chris Gibson's Newsletter "Content I Consumed" Alfie's LinkedIn Chris' LinkedIn
55:43
January 13, 2023
#10 CEO & Co-Founder @Wavelength, Chris Gibson | Bootstrapping a business | Edtech buying dynamics | Cofounders | Finding first customers
#10 CEO & Co-Founder @Wavelength, Chris Gibson | Bootstrapping a business | Edtech buying dynamics | Cofounders | Finding first customers
(00:53) Wavelength Overview (02:09) The Idea - How to better map user networks using organization data (06:02) Why Wavelength was bootstrapped (07:55) Reason for alumni networks. Importance of donations (10:37) Why Wavelength focused on data. What it does with the data (14:47) Why focus on schools (17:17) Problem of focusing on product vs distribution (19:55) Colleges vs high schools. Endowments and how they work (27:52) Importance of domain expertise (32:06) Cofounder dynamic (39:43) First customer strategy (45:30) Motivation of building Wavelength. (53:29) Major takeaways Wavelength The Search For Growth Podcast Alfie Marsh B2B Go-To-Market Advisory Alfie's Newsletter "Rocket GTM" Chris' Newsletter "Content I Consumed" Alfie's LinkedIn Chris' LinkedIn
56:32
January 06, 2023
#9 CEO & Co-Founder @ Pocus, Alexa Grabell | Co-founder dating | Stanford's Lean Launchpad program | Tips for female founders
#9 CEO & Co-Founder @ Pocus, Alexa Grabell | Co-founder dating | Stanford's Lean Launchpad program | Tips for female founders
(00:00) Intro to Alexa (04:15) When did Alexa know she wanted to be an entrepreneur  (06:20) Problems experienced at Dataminr that inspired Pocus (08:30) Stanford's "Lean Launchpad" program designed to help you launch your idea (12:15) How to choose your co-founder (20:30) Only 2.4% of VC money went to solely female founders. Alexa's tips for female founders (24:30) Importance of having the right people on your cap table (30:10) Community driven category creation (33:30) Category creation
40:58
December 16, 2022
#8 Generative AI, What is It and Where We are Going
#8 Generative AI, What is It and Where We are Going
In today's episode we discuss generative AI: (1:33) Generative AI - What it is, how it works (7:31) Market landscape (13:18) Data vs models (28:22) Text vs images vs video - Where are we with generative AI across data types (33:47) How will AI impact interviews, art (39:23) Natural language interfaces and how work will evolve (45:17) Dynamic content - video games and sales (49:16) Cool AI companies Chris Gibson - Founder of Wavelength LinkedIn Twitter Newsletter Alfie Marsh - Head of US Go-To-Market at Spendesk LinkedIn Newsletter The Search For Growth website www.thesearchforgrowth.com Episode links discussed Sequoia Generative AI: A Creative New World Sequoia Market Map - See here for complete list of companies discussed Ben's Bites
57:43
December 09, 2022
#7 Startup lessons from 2x international expansions at Spendesk
#7 Startup lessons from 2x international expansions at Spendesk
(00:00) Intro  (00:50) Feedback from listeners (03:00) Podcast starts - intro to Alfie's journey (06:00) Three takeaways  (06:30) Customer Development vs Acquisition Go-To-Market motions (14:00) Who to send abroad for international expansions (16:00) Speed of feedback (18:15) Identifying whether you're lacking PMF vs Go-To-Market fit (20:00) The email we used to get our first 50 customers (21:45) Leveraging your strengths to finding your first customers (24:00) The PSP framework to pivots: Product / Segmentation /Positioning  (27:50) How to know which pivots you need to make (29:00) The flaws of A/B testing (33:00) Framework for learning: 70% doing 20% self-directed 10% asking others (34:50) The cook vs chef dynamic (37:00) Why Chris disagrees with the 70/20/10 learning framework (40:00) Context of advice is more important than the advice itself (42:00) Customer development process in more detail (43:00) Three key takeaways of the pod  (43:30) Links to newsletters and where to find us (The email that got us our first 50 customers) (Four Steps to an Epiphany) (The chef vs cook principle) 
44:47
December 02, 2022
#6 Storybrand: The 7 step framework to strategic storytelling by Donald Miller
#6 Storybrand: The 7 step framework to strategic storytelling by Donald Miller
(00:00) Intro  (01:40) Feedback from listeners (03:55) Best books on storytelling for entrepreneurs  (05:20) Chris' company Wavelength (06:40) Storytelling basics (09:10) The 7 part framework summary (11:00) How to use the framework in your own story (13:10) The Hero has a problem (22:55) Everyone needs a villain (26:50) The Hero vs The Guide: How Jay-Z messed this up with Tidal (30:55) Guide offers a plan (40:00) Demonstrate the consequences of failure: Superbowl Ad example (46:00) The promised land  (47:35) Our newsletters In todays episode we discuss seven key takeaways from the book Storybrand and how you can build a strategic narrative for your startup. The framework we’ll be discussing is as follows: A Hero has a problem who meets a guide and gives them a plan which compels them to act and helps them avoid failure which ends in success Resources discussed (Storybrand) https://www.amazon.com/Building-StoryBrand-Clarify-Message-Customers/dp/0718033329/ref=sr_1_2_sspa?crid=IRR035L975GP&keywords=storybrand+donald+miller&qid=1669675221&sprefix=storybrand%2Caps%2C158&sr=8-2-spons&psc=1&spLa=ZW5jcnlwdGVkUXVhbGlmaWVyPUFRU09BMkwxM0NGTUwmZW5jcnlwdGVkSWQ9QTA3MTkyMTU4SEpMR1Y5U0M0V1ImZW5jcnlwdGVkQWRJZD1BMDA5MzQ1OTJKRkc4MTY4TVo5S0Imd2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9hdGYmYWN0aW9uPWNsaWNrUmVkaXJlY3QmZG9Ob3RMb2dDbGljaz10cnVl (Crossing the Chasm) https://www.amazon.com/Crossing-Chasm-3rd-Disruptive-Mainstream/dp/0062292986/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=crossing+the+chasm&qid=1669675152&sr=8-1 (Traction) https://www.amazon.com/Traction-Startup-Guide-Getting-Customers/dp/0976339609/ref=sr_1_4?crid=21BEYZOZ9B04K&keywords=traction&qid=1669675180&sprefix=traction%2Caps%2C220&sr=8-4&ufe=app_do%3Aamzn1.fos.08f69ac3-fd3d-4b88-bca2-8997e41410bb (Alfie's Newsletter)  https://alfiemarsh212.substack.com/ (Chris' Newsletter) https://chrisgibson.substack.com/
48:13
November 29, 2022
#5 Tech layoffs - why they are happening and why joining a startup now could make you rich
#5 Tech layoffs - why they are happening and why joining a startup now could make you rich
In today's episode we discuss tech layoffs: (01:33) Layoffs.fyi database on who's laying people off (02:50) Why tech layoffs are happening - inflation, interest rates, covid, war  (06:00) Interest rates impact on investors  (07:00) Net Present Value of future cash flows (08:00) Powerball lottery example (10:25) How tech startups dealt with the changing landscape (11:20) Extending runway (13:00) Good & bad examples of layoffs (14:15) Stripe's memo on laying off staff (16:13) Should CEOs have been able to predict the market and prevent over hiring (20:40) The financial decision behind joining a startup (23:00) How joining a startup now could make you rich (24:15) Is Elon the new Steve Jobs (27:30) Impact of layoffs for H1-B visa holders (30:35) Tips for finding a new job Alfie Marsh - Head of US Go-To-Market at Spendesk (LinkedIn) https://www.linkedin.com/in/alfie-marsh-0a435a69/ (Newsletter) http://www.rocketgtm.co/ Chris Gibson - Founder of Wavelength (LinkedIn) https://www.linkedin.com/in/chrisgibson14/ (Twitter) https://twitter.com/chggib (Newsletter) https://chrisgibson.substack.com/ The Search For Growth website www.thesearchforgrowth.com Episode links discussed https://layoffs.fyi/ (Stripe's memo on layoffs) https://stripe.com/newsroom/news/ceo-patrick-collisons-email-to-stripe-employees (Openview's 2022 Benchmark Report) https://openviewpartners.com/2022-saas-benchmarks-report/ (Techcrunch article for H1-B visa holders) https://techcrunch.com/2022/11/11/answers-for-h-1b-workers-whove-been-laid-off-or-think-they-might-be/
36:31
November 19, 2022
#4 Interview w/ Evan Gelfand, the Founder of Super F**king Simple
#4 Interview w/ Evan Gelfand, the Founder of Super F**king Simple
In today's episode, we interview Evan Gelfand. Evan’s LinkedIn Super F**king Simple event page This election's proposition guide Evan Gelfand is the founder of Super F**king Simple, an organization that simplifies civic engagement by hosting events to discuss contentious topics.  He started it in 2018 as a nonpartisan way for voters to make sense of city and statewide ballots. On October 25th, they had their Super F*cking Simple ballot event at Manny's, a community and learning cafe in the Mission in San Francisco. In addition to building Super F**king Simple, Evan is the Head of Experience at Mystery, an employee engagement platform that builds connection through curated virtual experiences. Previously, he was a Chief of Staff within YouTube. On this episode we talk about: How ballot propositions work Why voting on ballot propositions is important The only way to change the outcome of a proposition Simplifying complex and contentious propositions The challenge with ballot guides What Evan learned over the last four years of organizing the event The importance of non-partisan conversations How Super F**king Simple could be used as a safe place to discuss other contentious topics like climate change How influencers are leveraged to encourage people to vote Understanding financial incentives behind politics Evan’s favorite books and other quick-fire questions Links & resources discussed on the pod The Search For Growth Receive short video clips and summaries for each episode via our newsletter here For everything else, check out our website Alfie Marsh: Head of US Go-To-Market at Spendesk Alfie’s newsletter Rocket GTM 🚀 Alfie’s LinkedIn Chris Gibson: Founder of Wavelength Chris’ newsletter Content I Consumed Chris’ LinkedIn
50:57
November 08, 2022
#3 Seven takeaways from "The Psychology of Money" by Morgan Housel
#3 Seven takeaways from "The Psychology of Money" by Morgan Housel
The Search For Growth is brought to you by: Alfie Marsh (Head of US Go-To-Market at Spendesk and founder of Rocket GTM newsletter) Chris Gibson (Founder of Wavelength) Like short video snippets with the key points? Sign up to our newsletter. For everything else go to our website. ———————————————————— In todays episode we discuss Morgan Housel’s book “The Psychology of Money: Timeless lessons on wealth, greed, and happiness” Feedback from listeners about our last episode Why we chose the name “The Search For Growth” Why Chris loved this book Summary of key takeaways (see details below) Announcements ———————————————————— Summary of key takeaways: 1. No one’s crazy People who make financial decisions based on their own personal context, it may relevant to them, but it may not be relevant to you. Chris & Alfie give examples of how they and their wives handle money differently. VCs investment during a 0% rate environment compared to normal times. 2. Compounding is important $81.5bn of Warren Buffet’s wealth came after his 65 birthday. Impressive things are achieved through compounding small habits over long periods of time. 1% improvements over step function growth. 3. Be financially unbreakable Making good investments is not about good decisions, it's about consistently not screwing up. Be financially unbreakable. Stick around long enough to make wonders happen. Planning is important but assume things won’t go to plan. How VC firms are set up asymmetrically for success and default unbreakable. De-risking the downside. 4. Power Law You can be wrong a lot of the time and still make a fortune. 65% of companies within a fund lost money, 2.5% made 10-20x, 1% made 20x, and 0.5% made >20x. Therefore, you can lose a lot, but still come out on top. Optimize for exposure to opportunity. Meeting one person can change your life, optimize for the long term exposure not short term. 5. Freedom Controlling your time is the highest dividend money can pay. Tim Ferris’ “4 Hour Work Week”. The highest form of wealth is being able to choose how you spend your time. The problem with the story about the rich banker and the fisherman. The hedonic treadmill problem. Trades off between bootstrapping vs venture backed startups. 6. Reasonable over rational decisions Better to be mostly reasonable than coldly rational. Being reasonable doesn’t always mean rational, example choosing stocks you enjoy following may not be the best financial decision but it’ll keep you in the game long enough to learn how to execute a good strategy. 7. Beware of taking financial cues from people playing a different game  Example, momentum traders trading the tech stock boom. The danger of advice without context. Searching for context not advice. ———————————————————— Links & resources discussed on the pod. Our website - The Search For Growth Alfie’s newsletter - Rocket GTM 🚀 The Woof Gang Shop - Bow ties for dogs
01:01:16
October 30, 2022
#2 Learning from burn out | Managing underperformance | Defining your "motivation story"
#2 Learning from burn out | Managing underperformance | Defining your "motivation story"
On this week's episode we discuss: Lessons from burnout  The CAM Framework for dealing with underperformance  Trident Skillsets - why UFC fighter Conor McGregor is so unique Why "Motivation Stories" are a powerful tool in enduring hardship How personality traits guide career choice Your hosts Chris Gibson: Founder @ Wavelength Alfie Marsh: Head of US GTM @ Spendesk
01:05:01
October 22, 2022
#1 The "Resulting" Framework | Lessons from hitchhiking | Hacking startup events
#1 The "Resulting" Framework | Lessons from hitchhiking | Hacking startup events
Rocket GTM is brought to you by  Alfie Marsh (Head of US Go-To-Market at Spendesk and founder of Rocket GTM newsletter)  Chris Gibson (Founder of Wavelength) In todays episode we discuss:  Annie Duke's book called "How To Decide" and taking lessons from poker into the startup world  How Chris view's professional poker playing as an analogy for starting a company Chris' journey across the 3,000 mile Continental Divide Trail and how the lessons he learned apply to company building How Spendesk used fake WIFI to hack a startup event 
01:05:05
October 19, 2022