Skip to main content
The Third Coin

The Third Coin

By Dan, Grant, and Lewis May

A conversation about the past, present, and future of Blockchain, Crypto, NFTs, and technology.

Discussions, interviews, answers, opinions, and maybe some conversation about, "What is the third coin?"

Hosted by Lewis May, Grant Cermak, and Dan Mueller. A marketer, a blockchain guru, and a crypto veteran.
Available on
Apple Podcasts Logo
Castbox Logo
Google Podcasts Logo
Pocket Casts Logo
RadioPublic Logo
Spotify Logo
Currently playing episode

NFTs are Cute, Chia's Plans are Revolutionizing the Future of Finance

The Third CoinMar 28, 2022

00:00
24:32
NFTs are Cute, Chia's Plans are Revolutionizing the Future of Finance

NFTs are Cute, Chia's Plans are Revolutionizing the Future of Finance

In NFTs are Cute, Chia's Plans are Revolutionizing the Future of Finance, the 7th Episode in Season 2 of The Third Coin Podcast we discuss the plans that the Chia organization has announced in their Ask My Anything September 2021 Zoom call.

In this discussion, we listen to 3 separate recordings from the Chia Leadership team where they talk about some missing functionalities in the Cryptocurrency world and their plans to develop solutions to handle these discrepancies.

We will be shedding some light on Clawbacks, Rate Limiting, and other elements of the custody of cryptocurrency and how they can and will be solved using Datalayer and the release of additional real-world wallet functions that will allow for mainstream use by more of the general public.

If you would like to listen to the full recordings of the excerpts in this show, here are the links.

https://twitter.com/i/spaces/1mnGedVoqmAKX

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8wT5rN5AZc&feature=youtu.be

https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=9GEu_O00qX4

Here is the summary of the show with links to the different chapters.

(00:01:05) Grant introduces the topics of today's show

(00:04:58) Excerpt from the Twitter Recording https://twitter.com/i/spaces/1mnGedVoqmAKX where Gene Hoffman talks about some needed functionality.

(00:07:45) We introduce the ideas of Rate Limits and Clawbacks in Crypto

(00:12:46) Examples of Custody and why they are important

(00:15:20) Intro to Datalayer and custody

(00:15:35) Gene about Datalayer https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9GEu_O00qX4

(00:16:28) Bram Cohen on what Datalayer will do https://twitter.com/i/spaces/1mnGedVoqmAKX

(00:16:52) How Datalayer, custody, clawbacks, and rate-limiting all intertwine

(00:18:39) Grant introduces the Chia Network Roadmap for 2021 and 2022

(00:19:23) No NFT work is announced at all

(00:19:25) The reiteration of how the Chia Roadmap is well defined and its focus is solely on FinTech related development

(00:20:25) Paul Hainsworth drives home the fact that Chia development is all about financial solutions. https://youtu.be/U8wT5rN5AZc

That wraps up today's episode.

Thank you for checking out our video. #chia #chiacoin

Don't forget to click the “follow” button to get notified about new episodes of this #podcast for the number one source of REAL and useable #cryptocurrency and #blockchain information.

The YouTube channel is at:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCucCMrtXlTMR8Vjd3d-ozFQ

The hosts of The Third Coin Podcast are:

Dan Mueller - crypto veteran

https://mobile.twitter.com/dishmandan

Grant Cermak - Crypto Guru, programmer, and founder of www.irulast.com

https://mobile.twitter.com/grantosan

https://mobile.twitter.com/CoinTheThird

and

Lewis May - marketer, rally race car owner, and co-driver

https://hammersportmarketing.com/



Mar 28, 202224:32
DeFi - Decentralized Finance on the Terra Blockchain

DeFi - Decentralized Finance on the Terra Blockchain

Defi - Decentralized Finance on the Terra Blockchain, we discuss and show examples of the exploding world of cryptocurrency decentralized finance.

Though the conversation is interesting, you may find it more valuable to watch this episode on YouTube.   https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCucCMrtXlTMR8Vjd3d-ozFQ

Much of the show is spent explaining defi and we also spend a significant time on Terra Station, which probably has the largest ecosystem around defi out of all the blockchains.

Terra is the name of the blockchain and Luna is the coin on that chain.

Here are the links we go to in this episode.

https://station.terra.money/

https://station.terra.money/wallet

https://faucet.terra.money/

https://www.anchorprotocol.com/

https://app.anchorprotocol.com/

https://www.mirror.finance/

https://mirrorprotocol.app/#/trade

And the YouTube video we watched:

Anchor Protocol: Terra's DeFi MONEY MACHINE!! Complete Guide!

Here is the timestamp of the chapters of our discussion.

(00:01:10) Grant introduces Defi

(00:02:07) A quick explanation of finance that many people do use and how it is like defi

(00:05:40) Stable coins, why and how they are necessary for Defi

(00:12:30) How to incentivize investors and why it is part of Defi

(00:13:42) An explanation of Assetized Stable Coins

(00:14:00) An explanation of Algorithmic Stable Coins

(00:16:50) Where is Defi happening?

(00:17:03) Terra, and why it is interesting

(00:17:41) Looking at the main Terra Station website, the difference between web two and web three

(00:18:48) Diving into the Terra wallet

(00:22:08) Getting free testnet Luna at the Terra Faucet

(00:22:57) Swapping Luna and the other available protocols

(00:24:17) Introduction to Anchor in the Terra wallet

(00:26:04) Looking at the Anchor Dashboard

(00:27:14) Watching part of a YouTube about staked Luna and staked Eth from the Coin Bureau YouTube Channel

(00:28:28) A simplified explanation about the different aspects of the defi business model

(00:34:40) Back to the Terra Statin wallet to swap our Luna for some UST and then stake it on Anchor

(00:39:58) Checking out the “illegal” mirror protocol.

That wraps up today's episode.  Thank you for checking out our video.

#chia #chiacoin #terra #terrastation #luna #mirrorprotocol #anchorprotocol #defi #stablecoin

Click the “follow” button for new episodes of this #podcast. The source for REAL and useable #cryptocurrency and #blockchain information.

Dan Mueller - crypto veteran

https://www.facebook.com/dishmandan

Grant Cermak - Crypto Guru, programmer, and founder of www.irulast.com

https://mobile.twitter.com/grantosan

https://mobile.twitter.com/CoinTheThird

Lewis May - marketer, rally race car owner, co-driver, and founder at https://hammersportmarketing.com/

https://www.facebook.com/lewis.t.may

https://linkedin.com/in/lewistmay/



Mar 13, 202245:56
Chia Asset Tokenization and Offer Files on the Chia Blockchain

Chia Asset Tokenization and Offer Files on the Chia Blockchain

In this episode of The Third Coin Podcast, Chia Asset Tokens and Offer Files on the Chia Blockchain.  Grant and Dan introduce Chia Asset Tokens and Offer Files.  Two new real-world use cases, one of which is exclusive to the Chia blockchain.

(00:01:07) Grant introduces some new topics about Chia,

(00:02:48) Dan explains offer files on the Chia blockchain.

(00:03:48) Lewis asks how this differs from other chains and Grant clarifies what is new and what is similar to other blockchain codes.

(00:08:20) Grant and Lewis talk about escrows and how blockchain can solve this real-world problem of trust.

(00:11:37) Dan talks about his acquisition of CATs, the Chia Asset Tokens that are being produced and traded.

(00:13:02) Grant and Dan talk about Chia Offer Files and how they can have more than two parties take place in a transaction.

(00:13:56) Lewis and Grant realize how because of offer files and the fast-moving market of crypto that equity can be found when looking for offers that are still open.

(00:16:57) Lewis and Grant talk about the idea behind the tech that created “offer files”.  This transitions to how the “coin” or UTX model blockchain works.  How in the coin model you always only have one coin in a wallet.  That one coin is the value sum of all your coins.

(00:23:24) Lewis asks if you can trade other blockchains through the offer files…

(00:23:41) This moves the discussion to “wraps” of the wrapping of a coin which is recommended for the next show.

#chia #chiablockchain #bitcoin #ethereum #Assettokens #assettokenization #crypto #cryptocurrency #nft #nfts #nonfungibletoken #blockchain

That wraps up today's episode.

Thank you for checking out our video.

Don't forget to click the “follow” button to get notified about new episodes of this #podcast for the number one source of REAL and useable #cryptocurrency and #blockchain information.

If you prefer to listen to this in podcast format, all of our platforms can be found here:

https://anchor.fm/thethirdcoin

The hosts of The Third Coin Podcast are:

Dan Mueller - crypto veteran

https://www.facebook.com/dishmandan

Grant Cermak - Crypto Developer Guru and founder of www.irulast.com

https://mobile.twitter.com/grantosan

https://mobile.twitter.com/CoinTheThird

and

Lewis May - marketer, rally race car owner, and co-driver

https://hammersportmarketing.com/

https://www.facebook.com/lewis.t.may

https://www.linkedin.com/in/lewistmay/

Feb 20, 202227:18
Something's Fishy about The Bitcoin Heist, The Third Coin Podcast

Something's Fishy about The Bitcoin Heist, The Third Coin Podcast

In this episode, we talk about privacy on a blockchain and what that means but to get there first we talk about how Something’s Fishing about the Bitcoin Heist Arrests on The Third Coin Podcast.

The Third Coin Podcast is a conversation about the past, present, and future of Blockchain, Crypto, NFTs, and technology.  Discussions, interviews, answers, opinions, and maybe some conversation about what is the third coin.

(00:00:32) Lewis intro’s the show

(00:01:28) The gang talks about the people involved, Heather Morgan, 31, a published Forbes writer and rapper, who goes by the name 'Crocodile of Wall Street,' and her husband Ilya Lichtenstein, 34, a startup founder.

(00:01:42)  Dan quote the article

(00:02:32)  Grant gives his opinion, “something doesn’t smell right” we joke a little more, and at

(00:03:43)  Lewis begs the question, “how does one steal bitcoin?” and Grant Explains. Grant, Dan, and Lewis continue about private keys and mnemonic word keys.  The conversation refocuses back to how one steals bitcoin for 4 minutes.

(00:07:53)  Dan explains how glitches and vulnerabilities are the other way bitcoin could be stolen.

(00:08:40) Grant finishes explaining wallets and how the coin is transferred and stored, ultimately what has to happen for it to exchange hands and what the ledger says.

(00:12:08) Grant tells us about how to have a completely anonymous wallet.

(00:14:24) Lewis makes the statement that most people aren’t putting the correct thought about how to remain anonymous and the conversation starts to explain the different ways an anonymous wallet becomes “doxxed” or exposed.

(00:15:44) A good last explanation of what happens when people move stolen blockchain coins.

(00:17:15) After seeing that only 96,000 of the stolen bitcoins were recovered the discussion turns to how do you own and transfer digital assets without losing anonymity?

(00:17:53) Enter the privacy coin and coins like Monero. Multiple different questions and answers about privacy coins continue on.

(00:22:48) Lewis wraps it up with a statement about the Bitcoin heist and how it almost has to be purposeful to get caught doing what Heather Morgan and her husband Ilya Lichtenstein got caught for.

(00:24:24) Everyone wraps it up with some ideas for another discussion.

That's everything for today's episode.

Thank you for checking out our video.

Don't forget to click the “follow” button to get notified about new episodes of this #podcast for the number one source of REAL and useable #cryptocurrency and #blockchain information.

If you prefer to listen to this in podcast format, all of our platforms can be found here:

https://anchor.fm/thethirdcoin

The hosts of The Third Coin Podcast are:

Dan Mueller - crypto veteran

https://www.facebook.com/dishmandan

Grant Cermak - Crypto Programmer Guru and founder of www.irulast.com

https://mobile.twitter.com/grantosan

https://mobile.twitter.com/CoinTheThird

and

Lewis May - marketer, rally race car owner, and co-driver

https://hammersportmarketing.com/

https://www.facebook.com/lewis.t.may

https://www.linkedin.com/in/lewistmay/

Feb 18, 202229:10
Chia Coin, XCH - The Third New Blockchain, The Third Coin Podcast

Chia Coin, XCH - The Third New Blockchain, The Third Coin Podcast

In this episode of The Third Coin Podcast, Chia Coin, XCH - The Third New Blockchain, Lewis asks the team rudimentary questions about Chia.  Grand and Dan explain why it gets their attention and how different it is from Bitcoin and Ethereum.

(00:01:07) Grant explains Chia and Proof of Space and Time blockchain vs the types of blockchain tech that are more widely used.

(00:04:45) Grant and Dan explain how Bitcoin is a coin or UTX model and how Etherium is an account model.

(00:09:41) Grant explains how Chia Coin compares to File Coin and mostly how they don’t.

(00:12:36) Lewis asks how Chia is similar to Ethereum

(00:12:57) Grant's answer begins by explaining the history behind the development of blockchain.

(00:15:13) A recap about what makes Chia so different.

(00:17:33) We discuss Lewis’s first experience purchasing Chai and how he navigated through multiple wallets.

(00:28:17) Lewis explains how he has used some Chia faucets and found some tokens

(00:29:27) A great conversation ensues about Tokens versus Coins which then explains how Chia has a layer 2 similar to Eth but more suited for use.  This is a 10-minute conversation.

(00:40:31) Grant wraps up how big of a deal Chia really is.

(00:50:39) The group finishes by mentioning some more subjects to talk about as far as Chia and new developments with the tech such as offer files.

That wraps up today's episode.

Thank you for checking out our video.

Don't forget to click the “follow” button to get notified about new episodes of this #podcast for the number one source of REAL and useable #cryptocurrency and #blockchain information.

If you prefer to listen to this in podcast format, all of our platforms can be found here:

https://anchor.fm/thethirdcoin

The hosts of The Third Coin Podcast are:

Dan Mueller - crypto veteran

https://www.facebook.com/dishmandan

Grant Cermak - Crypto Developer Guru and founder of www.irulast.com

https://mobile.twitter.com/grantosan

https://mobile.twitter.com/CoinTheThird

and

Lewis May - marketer, rally race car owner, and co-driver

https://hammersportmarketing.com/

https://www.facebook.com/lewis.t.may

https://www.linkedin.com/in/lewistmay/

Jan 28, 202255:59
Layer One and Layer Two of the Blockchain - The Third Coin Podcast, Episode 6

Layer One and Layer Two of the Blockchain - The Third Coin Podcast, Episode 6

This episode is packed full of raw, unadulterated, unbiased information about Ethereum, gas fees, obscure Blockchain Tokens, defi in the crypto world, forks, and how to mint NFTs without paying huge gas fees. This is Layer One and Layer Two of the Blockchain - The Third Coin Podcast, Episode 6

(00:01:15) The discussion opens with a question about proof of work.  This transitions quickly into payment platforms and the utility of blockchain.  This is layer two.

(00:02:55)  After a brief opening Grant moves to discuss what and why level two on a blockchain.  He explains the functionality around the factors of scalability, decentralization, and security.

(00:04:21) We start to talk about proof of stake coin, (tokens)

(00:05:40) After a min or so Grant finally steps in and starts to explain it from a basic understanding.

(00:10:11) Lewis asks about proof of stake on the Ethereum chain.

(00:11:33) Grant covers forks in a blockchain and we converse about Ethereum and other things.

(00:19:04) Dan explains how the Ethereum coin works and then tells us what he really thinks. Video excerpt.

(00:20:27) Grant brings up Shibe Token when he looks at the project at the beginning of the year.

(00:23:16)  Grant brings up Defi, decentralized finance, and its implications.

(00:27:03) Lewis Asks about the regulation of defi and Grant elaborates on it.

(00:30:49)  The topic moves to why Eth is gaining right now.

(00:32:58) Dan talks about when he found out about bitcoin and bought some when it was 10 bucks.

(00:34:30)  Dan tells us about Buff DogeCoin and his experience with it.

(00:40:05) HUGE INSIGHT!  Grant explains how to get NFTs onto the Ethereum blockchain without paying gas fees for minting.

(00:41:35) We talk about NFTs and who owns what, including the Quentin Tarantino NFT Pulp Fiction lawsuit.

That wraps up today's episode.

Thank you for checking out our video.

Don't forget to click the "follow” button to get notified about new episodes of this #podcast for the number one source of REAL and useable #cryptocurrency and #blockchain information.

If you prefer to listen to this in podcast format, all of our platforms can be found here:

https://anchor.fm/thethirdcoin

The hosts of The Third Coin Podcast are:

Dan Mueller - crypto veteran

https://www.facebook.com/dishmandan

Grant Cermak - Crypto Guru and founder of www.irulast.com

https://mobile.twitter.com/grantosan

https://mobile.twitter.com/CoinTheThird

and

Lewis May - marketer, rally race car owner, and co-driver

https://hammersportmarketing.com/

https://www.facebook.com/lewis.t.may

https://www.linkedin.com/in/lewistmay/

Jan 18, 202247:06
Bitcoin “Taproot” Updates and Proof of Work - The Third Coin Podcast, Episode 5

Bitcoin “Taproot” Updates and Proof of Work - The Third Coin Podcast, Episode 5

The name of this recording is Bitcoin “Taproot” Updates and Proof of Work - The Third Coin Podcast, Episode 5, at (00:01:11) we get right into it by discussing the new “Taproot” update, why they are doing it, what it means, and why it took so long.

(00:07:52) Next in the discussion, we discuss the privacy, or lack thereof, of Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies.  We go on to talk about what you need to do if you truly want to have privacy when holding or using crypto.

(00:16:07) After this discussion comes to a close we move to “Proof of Work” and what that means.  This segways into what really happens during “mining” and how it is done.  We talk about “pooling” and the actual power consumption required to mine crypto coins.

(00:29:15)  This segues into a discussion about Evergreen, Binance, Tether, the financial markets, and how or what is linked to the drop of Bitcoin below 60k.

(00:33:23) During a natural stop in the conversation, we take a look at a couple of TikToks to learn how Dan and Grant feel about the opinions presented in them.

(00:35:29) Lastly, we talk about the Blockchain and other possible uses for it including storing data and information.  We discuss layer 1 and layer 2 and what that means to everyday users.

Thank you for checking out our video.

Don't forget to click the "follow” button to get notified about new episodes of this #podcast for the number one source of REAL and useable #cryptocurrency and #blockchain information.

If you prefer to listen to this in podcast format, all of our platforms can be found here:

https://anchor.fm/thethirdcoin

The hosts of The Third Coin Podcast are:

Dan Mueller - crypto veteran

https://www.facebook.com/dishmandan

Grant Cermak - Crypto Guru and founder of www.irulast.com

https://mobile.twitter.com/grantosan

https://mobile.twitter.com/CoinTheThird

and

Lewis May - marketer, rally race car owner, and co-driver

https://hammersportmarketing.com/

https://www.facebook.com/lewis.t.may

https://www.linkedin.com/in/lewistmay/

Jan 14, 202248:30
Bitcoin Diverges from Eth and more on NFTs - Episode 4 of The Third Coin Podcast

Bitcoin Diverges from Eth and more on NFTs - Episode 4 of The Third Coin Podcast

In this episode, Grant and Lewis start off by discussing the possibility that Bitcoin is diverging from Ethereum with respect to its USD value.

Next, they watch a TikTok video that mentions the possibility of exorbitant “gas fees” on the Ethereum network because of all the NFTs that are for sale.

This leads to a discussion about what these networks are for and how the different factors such as scalability affect the network.

The discussion moves to NFTs, Non-fungible Tokens, and what they do, what they are, and what they aren’t.

All this and more on this episode of The Third Coin.

Follow all of us and click the button to follow this #podcast for the number one source of REAL and useable #cryptocurrency and #blockchain information.

The hosts of The Third Coin Podcast are:

Dan Mueller - crypto veteran

https://www.facebook.com/dishmandan

Grant Cermak - Crypto Guru and founder of www.irulast.com

https://mobile.twitter.com/grantosan

https://mobile.twitter.com/CoinTheThird

and

Lewis May - marketer, rally race car team principal, and co-driver

https://hammersportmarketing.com/

https://www.facebook.com/lewis.t.may

https://www.linkedin.com/in/lewistmay/

Dec 15, 202133:01
NFTs, Real Crypto Market Pressure, and Fabricated Value - Episode 3 of The Third Coin Podcast

NFTs, Real Crypto Market Pressure, and Fabricated Value - Episode 3 of The Third Coin Podcast

NFTs, Real Crypto Market Pressure, and Fabricated Value - Episode 3 of The Third Coin Podcast

This Episode of The Third Coin has a ton of valuable information about NFTs, Real Crypto Market Pressure, and Fabricated Value in #NFTs and #Cryptocurrencies.

Right out the gate, we start to talk about NFTs and whether or not they are actually on the blockchain. We have a question and answer session between Grant, Lewis, and Dan.

This topic of conversation segues into onramps, in-flow, out-flow, and some of the generalizations about market pressure in the cryptocurrency market.

This episode has some great content from the perspective of Grant and Dan who have both been involved in crypto since its inception.

Follow all of us and click the button to follow this #podcast for the number one source of REAL and useable #cryptocurrency and #blockchain information.

The hosts of The Third Coin Podcast are:

Dan Mueller - crypto veteran

https://www.facebook.com/dishmandan

Grant Cermak - Crypto Guru and founder of www.irulast.com

https://mobile.twitter.com/grantosan

https://mobile.twitter.com/CoinTheThird

and

Lewis May - marketer, rally race car team principal, and co-driver

https://hammersportmarketing.com/

https://www.facebook.com/lewis.t.may

https://www.linkedin.com/in/lewistmay/

Dec 13, 202129:39
Why Bitcoin - Episode 2 of The Third Coin Podcast

Why Bitcoin - Episode 2 of The Third Coin Podcast

On this episode of The Third Coin Podcast, Episode 2, Why Bitcoin.  Dan still looks like a cop and decides to talk to his therapist about it.   

The Gang decides to talk about various different things and starts off with the news that the World Bank is talking about a carbon trading #blockchain on #chia.  

Welcome to the third coin  With Grant Cermak - founder of Iralast, Lewis May - founder of Hammersport, and Dan Mueller, a crypto dad.  

First off the team discusses Bitcoin because Lewis asks, "why Bitcoin".  

Naturally, this pile spiraled into a discussion about what was going on in the world during the development of the Bitcoin code around 2008 to 2010, and then naturally who is Satoshi Nakamoto? Obviously, we discuss Bitcoin Pizza day.  

Next, we touch on #NFTs and quickly Segway into Quantum Computing and whether that will affect blockchain as we know it.  

Next, we take a deep dive into who is and could be Satoshi Nakamoto discussing some of the people who claim they are all the while discussing forks and how they happen.  

A large portion of the end of this podcast is spent discussing  Bitcoin Forks, nodes, decentralization, and how all of this works together as to why blockchain became a thing.  

In the end, we briefly discuss the #tokenization of cryptocurrency and then we wrap it up.   

Follow all of us and click the button to follow this #podcast for the number one source of REAL and useable #cryptocurrency and #blockchain information.  

The hosts of The Third Coin Podcast are:  

Dan Mueller - crypto veteran  

https://www.facebook.com/dishmandan 

Grant Cermak - blockchain guru and founder of www.irulast.com  

https://mobile.twitter.com/grantosan 

https://mobile.twitter.com/CoinTheThird and   

Lewis May - marketer, rally race car owner, and co-driver  

https://hammersportmarketing.com/ 

https://www.facebook.com/lewis.t.may 

https://www.linkedin.com/in/lewistmay/

Dec 04, 202140:11
Intro to the Podcast and the Hosts - Episode 1 of The Third Coin Podcast

Intro to the Podcast and the Hosts - Episode 1 of The Third Coin Podcast

This is the first episode of The First Coin, our podcast to have a conversation about the past, present, and future of Blockchain, Crypto, NFTs, and technology. 

In this episode, we talk about all the beginnings of Bitcoin.  How it worked a decade ago and how it works now.

We discuss custodial wallets and noncustodial and then we slip into some analogies about blockchain and how it is basically a very crappy network, but a peer-reviewed one.

Grant goes on to explain Etherium, its history, and what makes it a different technology than Bitcoin and all the Bitcoin forks that exist.

Finally, we talk about gas fees, NFTs, and some of the upcoming subjects that we will discuss in The Third Coin Podcast.

Follow all of us and click the button to follow this podcast for the number one source of REAL and useable cryptocurrency and blockchain information.

The hosts of The Third Coin Podcast are:

Dan Mueller - crypto veteran

https://www.facebook.com/dishmandan

Grant Cermak - Crypto Guru and founder of www.irulast.com

https://mobile.twitter.com/grantosan

https://mobile.twitter.com/CoinTheThird

and 

Lewis May - marketer, rally race car owner, and co-driver

https://hammersportmarketing.com/

https://www.facebook.com/lewis.t.may

https://www.linkedin.com/in/lewistmay/


Nov 19, 202143:13