In this episode, Jessie and Amanda openly discuss the ups and downs of associating UX to your personal identity and an all-in mindset. After burning out in a past tech career and diving into UX head first, Jessie and Amanda talk about the challenges of giving our career more meaning and the pressure we put on ourselves. As Jessie's dove into her love for poetry, she talks about what she's learned through the creative process and how it relates to her UX career.
Jessie is an experience designer by day and a poet by night (or early morning). She loves the process of making meaning out of chaos, whether it be with digital products or with our wild emotions. She's also an enthusiast for dancing, making silly songs, and cloud catching. Since the recording of this episode, Jessie performed at the Worldwide Vigil for the Victims of the Atlanta Shooting in March (you can watch it here: https://326vigil.org/) AND Jessie will be performing a piece of spoken word at this year's UX Hustle Summit -- talking about her UX career journey.
Enjoy the episode!
Go follow Jessie Lian: @yessietojessie
Join Jessie's poetry community: https://www.instagram.com/pezestrians/
Come to the UX Hustle Summit - September 24 & 25 - to see Jessie perform live: https://uxhustle.org
In this episode, Amanda talks about what to do when you're feeling overwhelmed, overworked, or just in a messy place. After coming back from a holiday weekend, it can feel like you need another vacation right away. Amanda shares what she's doing to combat this feeling and ultimately design a sustainable way of working for the long term.
Come to the UX Hustle Summit - September 24 & 25 - Early Bird on Sale now until July 24th: https://uxhustle.org
In this Episode, Amanda and Varun discuss how to implement Research in a way that is sustainable, valuable, and ethical. We talk about ways to research with cross-functional partners, the power of saying "I don't know" and acknowledging the implicit bias and challenges that come with research, annnnd Amanda talks about her UX wrestling persona.
Varun is cofounder and Head of Research at Apple & Banana where he believes that everyone can do fruitful research. Varun has spent his career immersed in psychology, technology and design at organizations like Facebook, Unitedhealth Group and Best Buy, along with rising startups across the country. When he’s not sharing perspectives, collaborations and applications of fruitful research, he can be seen teaching his dog how to roll over, going for bike rides and playing Last of Us 2.
Enjoy the show!
Get the first 25 pages of Varun's upcoming book + 25% off once it launches: https://appleandbanana.org
Go follow Apple & Banana on Twitter: @applebananaux
Come to the UX Hustle Summit - September 24 & 25 - Early Bird on Sale now until July 24th: https://uxhustle.org
Denise Nicole Francis is an Atlanta based Sr. Product Designer at a well-known Customer Relationship Management corporation with a focus in User Experience Design. Formerly a designer at The Weather Channel | An IBM Business, and a Visual and Creative Designer with Grammy award winning singer/songwriter India.Arie (who she still moonlights with as a designer) she still believes that her past ventures as an Architect with various Atlanta-based Architecture firms, shaped who she is today.
In this episode, Amanda and Denise talk about work/life integration, maintaining passion for the arts through creative outlets outside of work, and the benefits of community groups within larger corporations.
Follow Denise on Twitter & Instagram: @denisu81
Learn more about the UX Hustle Summit: https://uxhustle.org/
Get on the UX Hustle Summit waitlist to receive a 20% off discount: https://uxhustle.org/waitlist
Amanda Worthington is a UX Researcher and Designer with a background in civil engineering. She is organizing the third annual UX Hustle Summit, the world's only virtual UX career conference, and she has signed-on to become the next host of the UX Hustle Podcast. In this episode of the podcast, Sophia's final episode as host, Sophia and Amanda discuss the importance of daily affirmations, how the lines between work/life balance have become blurred over the past year, the overwhelm of opportunity in the UX field, and the importance of sanitizing your conference ball pit in a post Covid world. Enjoy!
Follow Amanda on Twitter: @amaeworthington
Connect with Amanda on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/amanda-worthington/
Keep up with Amanda on her website: https://www.amandaworthington.com/
Earl Nightingale, "The Strangest Secret," mentioned in the episode: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UygnXqoKrC4
Subscribe to The Object-Oriented UX Podcast: https://anchor.fm/ooux
Join the Rewired UX Newsletter: www.rewiredux.com/newsletter
Learn more about the UX Hustle Summit: http://uxhustle.org/
Get your UX Hustle Summit tickets here with a massive 40% off discount: https://hopin.to/events/ux-hustle-summit?code=e3f9a06b-6781-49fe-b45b-8e6383fff350
Tara Codrington is a Web Project Specialist with the Government of Alberta, Canada. She began her career in television, but followed her knack for breaking down complex problems into the online world, where she discovered a passion for accessible design and inclusive writing. In this episode, Sophia and Tara discuss defining who your project really serves, guerrilla user testing, and advocating for those who can't advocate for themselves.
Connect with Tara on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/taracodrington/
Follow Tara on Twitter: https://twitter.com/tarasdoingstuff
Become a Certified OOUX Strategist: https://www.rewiredux.com/services/certification
This episode is a little different! Sophia will take you through the basics of OOUX and the ORCA process. Then, together, we will take an example project through the first round of ORCA, the Discovery Round. Grab a pen and paper and get a hand-on lesson in this awesome way of kicking off your UX design efforts.
GET YOUR DISCOUNTED SPOT FOR THE OOUX WORKSHOP:
LEARN MORE ABOUT GETTING OOUX-CERTIFIED:
OOUXy Psychology Articles:
Don’t Dead Him: Why Verbs are Hard and What it Means for our UX Process:
The Object-Oriented User:
PRINT ME! Noun Foraging Document:
Kamilah Benjamin is a creative director and UX designer at Statefarm Insurance, a freelance brand design consultant, a leader and mentor in debt management, healthy living, and decluttering. And if that wasn't enough, she spends her free time practicing photography, designing typography and doing floral arrangement. In this episode of the podcast, Sophia and Kamilah discuss how to navigate corporate acronym overload, the importance of mindset while living amid the sometimes abrupt changes of the post-Covid world, and how to keep all the details in high complexity UX projects from falling through the cracks.
Follow Kamilah on Twitter: https://twitter.com/KamilahBenjamin
Connect with Kamilah on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kamilahbenjamin/
Keep up with Kamilah on her website: https://kamilahbenjamin.com/
Sign up to attend the Object Oriented UX Happy Hour: https://www.meetup.com/objectorientedux
Join OOUX Summer School: http://oouxsummerschool.eventbrite.com/
Become a Certified OOUX Strategist: https://www.eventbrite.com/e/object-oriented-ux-certification-program-cohort-3-tickets-109199468550
Amber Hicks is the very first Certified OOUX Strategist to be on the podcast. She was an elementary school teacher before changing careers to become an OOUX Designer for Norfolk Southern. In this episode of the podcast, Sophia and Amber talk about how OOUX gives you the tools to iterate on literally anything, how using storytelling can help you get buy-in more quickly when selling clients and engineers on the intention behind your designs, and whether or not we should be teaching UX to third graders. Enjoy!
Angel Banks has worked as a product manager and UX designer. She's also a speaker and organizer for the Atlanta tech community where she works to ensure an inclusive environment for the marginalized and underrepresented in tech. In this episode, Sophia and Angel discuss making the tech industry safe and inclusive for all, whether UX designers should learn to code, and job hunting as a woman of color.
7/12 90's Netflix Party: Clueless
7/22 REFACTR.TECH Rerun with Henri Helvetica
8/9 90's Netflix Party: Mortal Kombat
Women Who Code
7/7 Find Your Tech Talent / Co-Founder / Curiosity Lab + Women Who Code Atlanta
Intro to Being an Antiracist (video)
8/29 - Being an Antiracist at Home
10/31 - Being an Antiracist at Work
Your Black Friends are Tired
OOUX Summer School
Rewired UX Newsletter Signup
In this episode of the podcast, Sophia gives updates on all the changes happening: in her business, in her personal life, and in her mind. You’ll also be the first to get the scoop on Cohort 3 of the Object Oriented UX Certification Program.
OOUX Strategist Certification Program—Early Bird spots are on sale! (Sept 30th through Dec 2nd) https://www.rewiredux.com/services/certification
OOUX Summer School (August 22&23)
http://oouxsummerschool.eventbrite.com/ (You’ll get a $497 discount code to the OOUX Certification program with this purchase.)
Get 95% off OOUX Summer School (unlimited spots) and the chance to get 75% off the OOUX Strategist Certification Program (3 spots). Email Hello@rewiredux.com with a link to your Linkedin and your 1-2 sentence story. We’ll email you a discount code within 48 hours!
Sophia’s letter: Examining my Complicity (Without self-loathing) https://medium.com/@sophiavux/a-first-step-examining-my-complicity-without-self-loathing-f36251ff6588
In this episode of the podcast, Sophia, Ahren, and Bob discuss how taxonomies differ from folksonomies, how folksonomies differ from ontologies, and how common vocabularies keep design projects on track.
Ahren Lehnert is a knowledge management professional who has worked across many industries including marketing, health care, Federal and State government agencies, commercial and ecommerce, geospatial, oil and gas, telecom, and financial services. Bob Kasenshak has worked in business development, product development, and as a taxonomist since 2012. They are both senior taxonomists at Synaptica, an enterprise taxonomy and ontology management software company.
Follow Ahren on Twitter: @ahrenlehnert
Follow Bob on Twitter: @taxobob
Keep up with Synaptica on their website: Synaptica
Follow Synaptica on Twitter: Synaptica
Sophia has found success as a UX designer, speaker, Object-Oriented UX workshop facilitator, UX community leader, writer, and podcaster. In this episode, Sophia discusses leveraging your day job, calendar blocking, teaching what you want to learn, creating personal accountability, being the "8-bit" version of whatever you want to be--all the methods she has found useful in bringing her endeavors to fruition and how you can use them to achieve your own side hustle success.
Course for free for 3 days, until May 24
Course for $10, Expires May 26
NewStory Charity: https://newstorycharity.org/
Sign up for the UX Hustle Newsletter: https://www.rewiredux.com/newsletter
Online Course Masters Podcast: https://onlinecoursemasters.com/podcast/
Sophia on User Defenders: https://userdefenders.com/podcast/069-we-are-all-pioneers-with-sophia-prater/
Ben Simmonds is a senior UX practitioner with 20 years of experience making technology better in London, Sydney, and now in Bristol as an independent consultant. As a compliment to UX Design, Ben is also a certified Performance, Stress, and Productivity coach. He runs "UX Without The Stress" workshops to help teams and individuals navigate complex, demanding projects. In this episode of the podcast, Sophia and Ben discuss teaching what you want to learn, the information architecture of stress, and how Object-Oriented UX deconstructs complexity to enable better design. Enjoy!
Sign up for Ben's next online "UX Without The Stress" workshop, scheduled for May 23, at the link below.
Keep up with Ben on his Website: http://www.bensimmonds.co/
Follow Ben on Twitter: @bensimmonds
Connect with Ben on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ben-simmonds-0312922/
Sign up for Ben's "UX Without The Stress" workshop! https://www.uxwithoutthestress.eventbrite.com
Read Sophia's A List Apart article on OOUX: https://alistapart.com/article/object-oriented-ux/
Matt Trinetti is a writer, publisher, speaker, and workshop facilitator who specializes in helping people and companies live and work deliberately. He's also a dear friend of Sophia's and a fellow Georgia Tech alum. In this episode of the podcast, they discuss how to listen to and act on those "quiet dreams" we all have, how to prototype the big life changes that can come from that, and how to formulate great workshop facilitation. Enjoy!
Learn more about living deliberately by following Matt's blog: https://www.giveliveexplore.com/
Follow Matt on twitter: @trinetti
Interested in going down the rabbit hole with OOUX? Get certified! OOUX Strategist Certification: https://www.rewiredux.com/services/certification
Bram Wessel is a Principal and Founder at Factor Firm, an information architecture consultancy out of Seattle, Washington that has done work for a few brands you've probably heard of including Adobe, Amazon, Disney, Intel and Microsoft. Bram has spent more than 20 years as a human-centered design professional, thought leader and speaker advocating for the IA/UX discipline. As if he wasn't cool enough, he also teaches the discipline to the next generation via his advanced User Experience and certificate Information Architecture classes at the School of Visual Concepts and as a guest lecturer at the University of Washington’s MCDM and MLIS programs. In this episode of the podcast, we discuss how UX designers really are modern day philosophers, how that all-important sweet spot between technical development and design expression, the information layer, has been neglected for far too long, and how Agile development is an unattainable goal. Be warned, this is a geeky one! Enjoy!
Bram’s IA Shop: https://factorfirm.com/
OOUX Strategist Certification: https://www.rewiredux.com/services/certification
OOUX Free Webinar: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1DByNw3xvmBnr106wf4VSgRqrnobnj8g2/view?usp=sharing
Enterprise Experience Conference: https://rosenfeldmedia.com/enterprise2020/
Caroline Sober-James has journeyed from database architect to UX designer to a fellow object-oriented UX evangelist. She’s the UX Director at Acumium in Madison, WI, where she strives to lead her team with “radical candor.” We discuss how leaders can create an environment for innovation and how team members can demand it. We look at how OOUX can help with client meetings as well as debate how OOUX applies to fantasy games, board games, and classic Nintendo. Enjoy!
Radical Candor: https://www.amazon.com/Radical-Candor-Revised-Kick-Ass-Humanity/dp/1250235375/ref=sr_1_2?crid=19AOO91RNIRDR&keywords=radical+candor&qid=1582133422&sprefix=radical+%2Caps%2C152&sr=8-2
M+DEV Conference: https://www.mdevconf.com/
Caroline’s slides: https://www.slideshare.net/csober/better-game-design-with-objectoriented-user-experience-ooux
Coming up! EntreFEST (June 4-5, 2020) in Cedar Rapids, IA https://www.entrefest.com/
***Sign up for Sophia’s newsletter to get notified about upcoming OOUX Certification Courses! www.rewiredux.com/newsletter
In this conversation, I talk to Ben Callahan, Sparkbox founder and design system expert. At Sparkbox, Ben has created an amazing workplace that facilitates learning, exploring, asking questions, and pet projects. We talk about how that awesomeness came to be and what’s working well today. (Team leaders, please take notes.) We also talk about taking time to tinker and figure yourself out—while the world seems to change right underneath your feet.
Of course, we get into design systems, too. We nerd out on documentation and discuss how being on the “design system team” can be a great part of company hazing >cough, cough< onboarding.
If you are revved up to apply for Sparkbox’s apprentice program, here’s your link: https://apprentices.seesparkbox.com/
Connect with Ben on Twitter: https://twitter.com/bencallahan
If you listen to the UX Hustle Podcast, you probably also listen to the User Defenders podcast, amiright? In that case, you might think you know Jason Ogle. Think again. In this super-candid episode, I interview THE interviewer. We get into his rocky path to becoming a UX designer and leader within the UX community. We talk about habit forming, design’s role in business, web design in the ’90s, the most important thing to communicate in a UX interview, the AI takeover, and so much more.
We also talk about mentoring and the importance of community. If you didn't already know how much Jason truly cares about his User Defenders and their success, you'll hear that passion shine through in this conversation. On that note, please check out Jason’s awesome User Defenders Community. The first 7 days are free, so there’s no reason NOT to give it a go: https://community.userdefenders.com. Here’s what it’s all about:
Caring & Genuine UX Community of 500 (and counting)
A safe place to connect, grow, and inspire
Benefits include early ad-free User Defenders: Podcast episodes, FREE members-only training sessions/AMA's from some of the biggest names in UX, Impactful Book Club We choose an inspiring design or growth-related book and discuss as a group through video-conference afterward, No Mark Zuckerberg or Jack, and countless irrelevant ads. Just an intuitive social network, entirely focused on UX and personal growth, with other wonderful, helpful humans as passionate about these topics as you are!
Resources mentioned in this episode:
The Miracle Morning
Pat Flynn’s Podcast
In this interview with Mailchimp UX Researcher Beth Godfrey, we talk about career, personas, socializing research, and public speaking for introverts. We get into how Beth transitioned from a UX generalist within an agency to focus on what she really loves: user research. The episode of full of belly laughs and golden nuggets—enjoy!
Beth’s Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/bethgodfrey/
Designing for Emotion book: https://amzn.to/36pft3V
NNg Newsetter: https://www.nngroup.com/articles/subscribe/
Calm Technology Book: https://amzn.to/34fWDdV
Microinteractions book: https://amzn.to/2Nsrzkd
Design for Sustainability book: https://amzn.to/2pyr5RN
Join the UX Hustle Newsletter! https://www.rewiredux.com/newsletter
Paul McAleer is the Content Strategy Director at Bouteous, an award-winning digital innovation agency. He joins us today to talk about the infuriating information architecture of pants (or lack thereof) as well as how progressive disclosure can help the usability of a UX portfolio. We also get into the distinction between IA and Content Strategy and where they overlap. Enjoy!
Stefanie Krievins is a big hearted, tough love professional career coach with lots of wisdom to give. Fair warning, a few F-bombs are peppered in with that wisdom! She specializes in change making within organizations and that’s why I wanted to have her on. For UX designers to do their job, they have to foster an environment that’s open to change. Because that’s what we do, we go in and make waves. In this episode Stefanie talks about how important it is to define success upfront, what type of questions to ask in a UX interview, and how to reframe the skills of a past career when you are transitioning into UX.
Stefanie will also be giving a lecture and mini-workshop at the UX Hustle Summit on Saturday Sept 7th. Go to UXhustle.org to learn more about the conference and when you get your ticket, enter uxhustlepodcast all lowercase.
Sign up for Stefanie’s course and join her community: https://stefaniekrievins.com/
Stefanie's Pro troublemaker worksheet: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1I91X2DjveQVcqVnNoU-_tAVA6M8dTjTC/view?usp=sharing
$50 off the UX Hustle Summit: https://uxhustlesummit2019.eventbrite.com?discount=uxhustlepodcast
The Secrets of closing the sale by Zig Ziglar https://www.amazon.com/Secrets-Closing-Sale-Included-Emotional/dp/B019NHUY8S/ref=sr_1_6?keywords=zig+ziglar&qid=1567191273&s=gateway&sr=8-6
Million Dollar Consulting by Allen Weiss https://www.amazon.com/Million-Dollar-Consulting-Professionals-Practice/dp/B01HBZCM66/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=Allen+weiss&qid=1567191364&s=audible&sr=1-1
TED Talk recommendation: Self-Love, be Intentional by Caitlyn Roux https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DCNOJmmHLkQ
In the course of just a few years, Gabriela Ospina has transformed her career. She's transitioned from designing print graphics to digital graphics to complex user experiences. We when spoke in December, she was working on the JP Morgan Chase investments mobile apps as a senior UX designer. But recently she’s moved onto a product design role at Namely, a company that builds software for Human Resources and payroll. As if finance was not complicated enough!
In this episode, Gabriela and I talk about her UX journey and how object-oriented UX has played a part. Along with some sharp OOUX skills, she’s also fueling her her trajectory with cross-fitter work ethic and a love of learning.
ANNOUNCEMENT! For those of you coming to the Generate Conference in New York City on April 24-25, Gabriela will be making a cameo appearance in our full day OOUX workshop. How exciting!
Leadership by design
The Hard Thing about Hard Things
It’s the second installment of my #UXyourLife series! In this episode, I’ll help you get more done with less stress. You’ll learn how to end your day feeling satisfied with what you’ve accomplished and set clear boundaries so you don’t take on more than you can handle. It’s time to fire your todo list and give your calendar a big promotion.
Book a 3-session private coaching course to help you implement calendar-blocking in your own life ($199 for THREE hours of private productivity coaching!) https://www.rewiredux.com/services/joyofdoing
Affiliate links to book resources:
Deep work https://amzn.to/2T6Uifq
Atomic Habits https://amzn.to/2TGFFEI
You are a Bad Ass https://amzn.to/2TDnvnm
Amy Landino’s Calendar Blocking video (and her entire channel, really) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LvZp-ogt1vw
Jenn Carrington Podcast: Chapter 10: Your are the vessel through which your work comes to life http://www.jencarrington.com/make-it-happen-a-podcast-for-bloggers-and-creatives/2018/6/27/chapter-10-your-are-the-vessel-through-which-your-work-comes-to-life
“Don’t judge everyday by the harvest you reap, but by the seeds you plant.” Yes, that’s Robert Louis Stevenson!
The BBC is sharpening the cutting edge of voice UI. In this episode, I talk to Paul Jackson, a senior UX Designer on the BBC's Voice+AI team. We discuss the joys and pains of being an #ElderMillennial, the sounds of the Tokyo train system, and aspirational voice UI projects. Geek out with us on “voice-first” design, user testing for voice, and how object-oriented UX might help make Alexa more intuitive. Also, learn one great way to break into the emerging field of voice UI.
Here’s Paul's Tokyo train sounds for your workday focus: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-kmdmNzUxpg
Paul on Twitter:
And Sophia’s OOUX your UX Portfolio Workshop in Atlanta:
Lili Feyerbend’s a UX designer with some serious geek street cred. She’s the cofounder of startup CryptoDecks and she’s also got a law degree tucked away in her resume. Lili is a practitioner of my object-oriented UX methodology and gave a lecture on OOUX at the Nifty Conference in Hong Kong this summer. In this episode, we talk about contextual navigation, crypto-assets, and her favorite rare Pepe. WARNING: We get into the weeds…you might want to avoid multi-tasking on this one. I hope you learn as much as I did!
When your are ready to get started with NFTs, make sure to visit https://cryptodecks.co.
PS! If you are interested in learning some of the hard skills around OOUX, check out the online event happening Feb 2nd, 2019. Use discount code UXHUSTLE for $30 off. https://www.eventbrite.com/e/object-oriented-ux-with-sketch-and-webflow-tickets-53751391860
In 2017, Karl Schulz brought me and my Object-Oriented UX workshop to the design team at Macys.com. One of the designers on the team was Devon Alkire-Cussen, who immediately clicked with OOUX. Today, Karl is bringing object-first thinking to Atlassian and Devon is bringing OOUX to CreditKarma. In this conversation, we sit down in my beautiful San Francisco Airbnb to talk about the twists and turns of their UX journeys, what makes a great UX designer, the challenges of OOUX, and the future of our industry.
Make sure to check out the swimwear company that Devon works with https://paliswim.com/
At the end of every episode, Saundi reminds us: "Don't wait for inspiration to act, ACT TO GET INSPIRED." Why does this statement always wrap up the Hustle? Because without this way of thinking, the UX Hustle podcast wouldn't exist.
In this solopisode, I'll take you through 7 principles that have revolutionized my ability to get shit done with less stress and more joy. Get out of your endless vortex of thinking, planning, ideating, sketching, researching—so that you can actually manifest all your ideas into the world.
Recommended further reading from this episode:
Miracle Morning (BOOK): https://amzn.to/2P5yXRo
War on Art (BOOK): https://amzn.to/2SdNxIA
Better than Before (BOOK): https://amzn.to/2QjRYnU
Calendar Blocking and Amy Landino (YouTube): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LvZp-ogt1vw
Havana Nguyen, a UX designer at Commissions Inc, first experienced the magical power of the Internet at age 12 when her Sonic the Hedgehog website became one of the top fan sites for this speedy creature. From there, her path to UX took many twists and turns, all of which have influenced how she works today. For example, after working as a customer service representative, she has a unique view on how to involve these roles in the design process.
We also have a ton to learn from Havana when it comes to managing our creative impulses and boundless curiosity (the curse of many UX designers). She’s a character artist for an award-winning comic, a YouTuber, a jujitsu fighter, and a blogger. But with some simple hacks, she manages to give all her interests the attention they deserve.
Not only is Havana’s story fascinating and inspiring, it’s incredibly useful. Enjoy!
Resources and links...
More on Havana: http://www.havananguyen.com/
NNG Newsletter: https://www.nngroup.com/articles/subscribe/
Havana’s interaction flows article: https://uxplanet.org/an-introduction-to-interaction-flows-a4f783402529
Micro interactions by Dan Saffer:
Steal Like an Artist by Austin Kleon: https://www.amazon.com/Steal-Like-Artist-Things-Creative/dp/0761169253
Sophia's force prioritization (OOUX) article: https://alistapart.com/article/object-oriented-ux
Chill hop for your Workshops: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M8HDvTuctOU
In the very first episode of the UX Hustle Podcast, Sophia talks to Zach Pousman, CEO of Helpfully, an innovation and UX firm in Atlanta. Sophia learns about WIMP and the magical 1-3-5 to-do list hack. They discuss the parallels between the command line and chatbots. Down the rabbit hole, Sophia and Zach explore the design challenges found in the blind void of voice UI. Zach gives sage advice on designing within constraints—when and how should you push the boundaries? He also talks about the philosophical difference between breaking down an engineering problem and a design problem.