The Wisconsin Runner Podcast

A man of remarkable range, from PR's of 1:51 and 3:50 to a top 5 GrindFest finish in a loaded year, to being the social media mastermind of WRRT, Joe Zack covers a similarly impressive range of topics in our spotlight. 

A graduate of Oconomowoc HS ('13) and UW-Oshkosh ('18), Joe talks us through his unique journey to finding the sport, growing his passion for running within a similarly growing team culture at Oconomowoc, and some of the highlights along the way. He also opens up about how just missing out on some of his biggest goals at the high school and collegiate levels have had silver linings that continue to shine through in his career today. 

2020 was a year that will be tough to forget. On top of all that went on in the world, it’s was also a very memorable one for one of the newest members of WRRT, Tai Dinger.

The 2019 Stanford grad and Washington DC native made the most of his racing opportunities, representing Team USA at the Pan Am XC Championships in February, and running a string of remarkable PRs (13:49 for 5k, 28:25 in his 10k debut) wherever he was racing in the fall.

Tai talks us through his decision to continue pursuing the sport, the transition to and challenges of training at an elite level with a rigorous work schedule, and the flow of extrinsic and intrinsic motivation. As one of the most process oriented folks we know, we loved getting a glimpse into the inner workings and transformations that played a prominent role in his 2020 breakthrough.

The loaded Wisconsin high school class of 2009 saw a proliferation of talent, producing a year in which it took 9:15 to make the medal stand in the 3200m. The man standing on that final podium position, John Simons of Arrowhead, had a weekend that looked to be the peak of an athletic career years in the making, bringing home two individual medals (though none higher than 5th place), as well as taking part in his team's runner-up 4x800m relay, culminating in a dominant team state championship for the Warhawks. His performances were significant breakthroughs, yet Simons, like several other members of Wisconsin's Sub-4 Club, was far from the most sought after talent coming out of the state that year. What may have appeared to others as a culmination was really a launching point.

With a college career that included transferring, uncertainty, disappointing performances, and a struggle to find the success he knew he was capable of, John once again burst forth on to the scene, this time on the NCAA level, with a now legendary performance at an indoor last chance meet at Notre Dame in 2013.

This episode is an excerpt from a forthcoming full-length episode with John, now an assistant coach at Dartmouth University. Keep an eye out for a great conversation about the full scope of John's career and some phenomenal insights on the power of self-belief in the days to come!

Catch our pre race and post race shows from this weekends first event in The Series, the Fort "Four".   We make some individual, team, and time predictions and then reflect on how close, or FAR off we were.  

Catch us on the Wisconsin Runner Racing Team Facebook Page for more immediate updates on events and live feeds, but we will always keep you in the loop here on the podcast.

Race results:

Results of The Series Race #1: The ~4 Miler*

Men:
1) Tai Dinger (Dinger's Ringers): 18:06
2) Tyson Miehe (Dinger's Ringers): 18:12
3) John Dewitt (The Dew Crew): 18:40
4) Andy Knapp (Dinger's Ringers): 18:49
5) Danny Machmueller (The Dew Crew): 19:13
6) Nathan Petesch (Dinger's Ringers): 19:25
7) Joe Zack (The Dew Crew): 19:33
8) Derek Johnsrud (The Dew Crew): 19:39
9) Erik Duethman (Dinger's Ringers): 20:08
10) Chase Robles (The Dew Crew): 20:22
11) Kyle Fraser (Dinger's Ringers): 21:14
12) Aaron Cahn (Dinger's Ringers): 21:46
13) Matt Borneman (Free agent): 22:48
14) Derek Rubis (The Dew Crew): 29:26 (virtual 4.1 in AZ; converts to 27:59)

Women:
1) Gabi Anzalone (The Dew Crew): 21:54
2) Erin Wagner (The Dew Crew): 22:37
3) Jessa Victor (Dinger's Ringers): 23:04
4) Andie Shine (The Dew Crew): 23:39
5) Kiera Depies (Dinger's Ringers): 24:26

*The course ran slightly short of 4 miles (most GPS readings were between 3.88 & 3.93), so adding .1 of a mile at an athlete's given pace (ie. 5:00 = 30 seconds) should give an indicator the time for a full 4 miles.

Team scores:
Dinger's Ringers: 1, 2, 3, 4, 6, (9) = 16
The Dew Crew: 1, 3, 5, 7, 8, (10) = 24

Hello once again everyone! We are back at it after our summer vacation, and much like the post office, trying to make sure we're able to deliver the goods to you fine folks, no matter what!

The pantheon of Wisconsin's sub-4 milers is filled with names like Hacker and Solinsky, whose ascent into such hallowed performances seemed all but certain at an early age. Some of the more recent additions to the club have not been state champions or the most highly touted recruit in their graduating class. This week's episode comes to us from someone who wasn't even the best middle distance runner on their own high school team.

In 2012, the Brookfield Central Lancers set the boys 4x800m state record to upset an incredibly deep field for the D1 title. The anchor leg carry of junior Carl Hirsch, unofficially timed at under 1:50, in addition to his commanding victories in the 1600 and 3200 were the talk of the weekend. The following year, Hirsch literally fell just short of pulling off the elusive 3200-1600-800 triple crown. It would take a state record performance from Eric Brown to defeat Hirsch, who hit the track just steps before the finish line. In addition to Brown, Hirsch's Lancer teammate Andrew Dusing crossed before Hirsch willed himself across the finish line in third place.

The Lancers had a dominant distance squad on the track, but the name Andrew Dusing did not appear on their cross country roster (He played volleyball). Dusing, who had carried the baton in the lead leg for the record setting BC relay, went on to attend college and compete for the University of Miami (Ohio), a program who did not sponsor men's indoor track & field. He would go on to be a First-Team NCAA Division 1 All-American, run 3:40 for 1500m, and spoiler alert, break 4:00 in the mile.

Our next installment of the "Sub 4 in Sub 4" series features Menomonee Falls North and UW grad, Tim Hacker. Hacker had a prolific career across a number of disciplines, including winning cross country titles at the NCAA and US Championships a dozen years apart, in 1985 (in Milwaukee) and 1997, respectively. His prowess on the track was just as remarkable, and it is that middle-distance skill set that brings us four minutes of his time today.

Tim holds the distinction of being the Wisconsinite to break 4 by the largest margin in his first sub-4:00 mile. He lays out how the race fit into his build up to that summer's Olympic Trials, as well as how the years since have impacted his perspective on the feat accomplished that day, just over 32 years ago. 

Matt Barrett's accomplishments over his nearly two decades of competitive running--a 9:13 altitude 3200m in high school, a pair of top 20 finishes at the NCAA Regional XC meet to help guide his college team to the national meet, and post-collegiate PRs of 65:18 and 2:23--are a lot to celebrate. Beyond his running resume, Matt carries a tremendous appreciation for each day, each run, and each breath. 

Diagnosed with Cystic Fibrosis before his first birthday, Matt talks about the challenges presented both by CF, as well as overcoming perceptions as an active youngster with the lung-afflicting disease. 

He also shares his insights into building culture, from his high school days during the beginnings of a juggernaut program at Monroe, to his time running for some great teams at the University of Minnesota. Matt's attitude, approach to the sport, and the way he treats others are a phenomenal example that the desire to bring the best out of yourself and those around you is a path to something truly special. 

With the help of a special guest host who gives us some insights into the days before he was a star, we've got another edition of the Sub 4 in Sub 4 series for all you track fans! Today's story features the breakout race that launched Sam Penzenstadler (Oshkosh West '11) onto the national scene. As a prep in Wisconsin, Sam finished 4th at the state cross meet in one of the closest years in recent memory (top 5 all within 5 seconds). On the track, he graduated with personal bests of 1:57 and 4:18, the latter from his 6th place finish at State. 

Penz entered the 2014 Meyo Mile at Notre Dame with modest credentials and a coach with tremendous faith in him. After a massive PR, Sam would go on to earn a pair of NCAA All-Americans that spring, including a 3rd place finish in the 1500m behind Lawi Lalang & Mac Fleet. He would go on to run professionally with The District Track Club in Washington, DC, including a victory at the 2016 Penn Relays. 

*One note that Sam sent us after his recording: Sam lists the decimals from this race as 3:58. 05, which is his overall PR from the following year. The official time on his first-ever Sub 4 was 3:58.21*

On this anniversary of the world's first sub-4 mile, we're launching our new series: "Sub 4 in Sub 4." Our hope is to share with you as many of the stories of Wisconsinites who have broke the elusive 4 minute mile barrier by having them tell the story, and do so in less than four minutes. 

The inspiration comes from a coincidence too surreal to be an actual coincidence. Our first in the series is Joe Stilin, a Milwaukee Rufus King '08 alum who went on to run collegiately at Princeton and the University of Texas, and has run professionally with Zap Endurance for the past 7 years. After we sat down with him and recorded his full interview, we asked him to tell the story of his first sub-4 story, and he just happened to do so in three minutes and 58 seconds. He sets a high bar for the "Sub 4 in Sub 4" challenge, and we hope to share more of these quick stories of fast runners with you in the weeks to come!

In one of our most wide ranging conversations yet, we are excited to be joined this time around by physical therapist and long-time friend AJ Sobrilsky. AJ has had a remarkably varied range of experiences in the running world, from an unconventional origin story as a former four-sport high school athlete to collegiate distance runner, all the way to being plugged in to the Mecca of the American distance running scene in Flagstaff. Beyond some catching up & sharing old stories, we dive into the key ingredients of creating a special running culture, the evolution of identity as a competitive runner, and get some insights from AJ & Spencer, two of the top running PT's in the game, about staying healthy & maximizing performance.  As always, we have some fun with his hot takes in the rapid fire round, including his pick of favorite Performance Running Outfitters owner. 

As we were scheming plans for where we wanted to go with the podcast after the Olympic Marathon Trials, we were looking forward to the spring HS & NCAA track season, road racing scene, and the build up to the Track & Field Trials and Olympics Games. Like so many, we've seen things change a lot in the last two weeks. 

Our most recent interview, recorded just at the start of all of these changes, opened the door to what the weeks to come can be about. For over a decade, Derek Rubis has been known throughout the running world as "The Hub of Distance Running." His passion for the sport began as a young runner growing up in Waukesha, and grew throughout his career at Carroll & beyond. 

In a time of "social distancing", Derek's ability to connect with runners across the world online through wall posts and his iconic "Face in the Hole" show that physical distance can't keep distance runners apart. We find out about the original "Takeover Bros," his favorite runs & runners, and the legacy that he hopes to create as distance running's biggest fan. 

As we gear up for the start of the 2020 Wisconsin high school track & field campaign, we are excited to share a conversation with a man who has made building the sport a priority, not only where he coaches, but across the state. In addition to the tremendous success of his Whitewater Whippets on the conference and state levels, Maas has been an integral part of the growth of the Wisconsin Track Coaches Association & annual clinic, promoting best practices and positive, athlete-centered coaching across Wisconsin. 

Unsurprisingly, Mark spent much of our time with him talking about and praising others. He talks candidly about what it was like coaching his sons to state titles, his goals for interactions with every athlete on his team, and how the way student-athletes feel about track has the capacity to shape their experiences, for better or worse. 

Best of luck to all the coaches and teams as they kick off their 2020 track campaigns! We're excited to see the incredible performances to come from across the state. 

Our final Miles of Trials profile is Math teacher, head track coach, and two-time US Olympic Marathon Trials qualifier John Dewitt. One of the most interconnected members of the Wisconsin running community, John's energy & passion for all aspects of the sport are a catalyst for so much good. If you've not had the pleasure of meeting Dewey, the enthusiasm, cleverness, and passion for others give a great glimpse into how he ticks.

We got to hear about John's start in the sport, including not running high school cross country until his junior year, as well as his decision to stay in his hometown of Oshkosh for college. We also catch a few of his many post-collegiate highlights, and his preparation and mindset ahead of this weekend's USOT Marathon in Atlanta. 

Special thanks to guest co-host Danny Machmueller, who provided both Girl Scout Cookies and all of the funniest moments in this week's episode! 

With the US Marathon Olympic Trials just over a week away we were lucky enough to sit down with 2xOlympic Trials Qualifier Caitlin Kowalke.

Caitlin takes us through her journey as a runner, from her first memories of racing, to running for the Badgers, and her time as a professional.  She also describes the challenges that she has faced throughout her journey and how she has balanced her life as a mother, wife, coach, employee, and extremely successful athlete.

As we close in on the final weeks before Atlanta, we are joined this week by Gabi Anzalone, who ran the USOT A Standard at the 2017 US Marathon Championships at CIM. 

In true Gabi fashion, we got to talk openly about the challenges she has faced in the sport, balancing a remarkable real life schedule, and falling back in love with the process through the running community. In an hour of emotion, humor, and resilience, we were so grateful for an authentic portrait of a remarkable runner and human being.

We are back with one of our fan-favorite guests, Muskego coaches CJ Michaud & Rich Raney! At the 2020 Wisconsin Cross Country Coaches Association, we sat down to talk about the NXN experience: the excitement, the challenges, and the spectacle of it all. They share their perspective on the balance of making it a business trip versus enjoying the complete experience out in Portland. We loved the glimpse into what it is like to compete at the highest level of team cross country on the high school level, and the growing role Wisconsin is having on the national scene. 

It's often easy to see the line of someone's path to the Olympic Trials as a pretty straight forward journey. Sure, there may be bumps in the road, but overall, the same heading towards a particular destination is evident at every step. This is not such a story. 

Beginning her running career as a pole vaulter, running her first NCAA races as a senior in college, and qualifying for the Trials on her second marathon--but over 5 years after her debut--are all just parts of the tremendous and turn-filled OTQ story of Hannah Christiensen. Find out about this Waterford, WI native's evolution in the sport, as well as her experiences with high-level ultimate frisbee. 

Following Tyson's recent induction to the WCCCA Hall of Fame we are back with part 2 of our interview with Tyson where he tells us stories about how it was having his Dad as his coach, helping to create a dynasty, and the success and failure that goes along with it.

Happy holidays everyone! While we're all enjoying some relaxed time with friends and family, we thought we'd talk a bit about the year that has been. We have been blown away by the feedback and support we've gotten from all of you, so first & foremost, THANK YOU! We've loved sharing some of these conversations and stories from the fantastic folks involved with our sport in Wisconsin. Today, we talk a bit about the big themes and highlights from our first two months of the pod. We also look ahead to 2020 and the things we are looking forward to personally, as well as all the ways we hope to keep things in the new decade funner with Wisconsin Runner. 

"What if we just ran until we couldn't anymore?" -Terry Witkowski, circa 2013

So began the world's largest indoor progression run, and the most fun night of distance running in the state of Wisconsin. 

In the past six years, Olympic Trials Qualifiers, NCAA All-Americans & National Champions, professional runners, and everyday runners have joined in the Grind to see how if they could be the one runner left standing. Starting at 6:08 pace and dropping every 3 laps (~1400m), GrindFest takes the progression run from a summer workout to a full-on race with an epic finish. 

We are pumped to bring you all another Championship Debrief, this time with the co-head coaches of the Girls D1 Wisconsin State Cross Country Champion Muskego Warriors. 2019 was the second consecutive title for Rich & CJ's squad, in addition to a runner-up finish in 2017. The guys talk about how their mantra and goal of "Better" helps build a culture of shared purpose and community, the thought process & goals behind not racing their top two runners until the conference meet in the 2018 XC season, and how mindset and training shifted this fall as defending State champs. 

We get a great insight into how overcoming ego, fear, and uncertainty led them to combine programs, and how it has enriched the experience for everyone involved. Michaud & Raney also share their takes on the challenges of balancing family life and coaching (including a very practical example from Rich), and how their humble origins as athletes enable them to connect broadly with their team to create a sense of purpose, regardless of an individual's PR. These guys are a blast to spend time with, and their passion for the sport and their program are evident in the way they talk about every aspect of what they do, and how & why they do it. 

24 hours after the Wisconsin State Cross Country meet, we sat down with Brian Finnel, the head coach of the D1 State Boys Champion Middleton Cardinals, to breakdown a tremendous final day of what has been an incredibly fulfilling season. He talks about how a squad that historically has been led by a podium finisher had six different number ones this year, the evolution of the team's mindset throughout the season, and how their program grew and learned from some hard days in the past. 

Brian offers a candid insight into the growth and changing identity of a program that has finished Top 3 at the the State Cross meet every year he has been at the helm. He also shares the legendary story of a two week stretch in the fall of 2017 that included having to (temporarily) part ways with his team just moments after being handed their first state championship trophy. We loved the conversation we were fortunate to have with Brian, and hope it's a fun and meaningful glimpse into the world of the newly minted state champions. 

On the eve of the 2019 Wisconsin State Cross Country Championships, we are excited to share our conversation with the man at the helm of a team that has had a phenomenal history at Ridges, Madison West Boys Head Cross Country Coach Tom Kaufman.  We learn about his beginnings in running and coaching, the challenges that the team has faced this season, and how he has helped to build one of the most successful high school programs in the state. He shares his approach to changing mindsets for what "success" is, coaching beyond workouts & mileage, as well as a bit about his iconic mustache.  We apologize for the background noise from the overhead fan, but the content is still GOLD.  Hope you enjoy this as much as we did.

Hey everyone, and welcome to The Wisconsin Runner Podcast! This week, we'll talk about the origins of the show, a bit about ourselves, and where we're headed.